Primarily for Doms but sub answers are welcomed would you be ok with it?

[foreducatio]

1 hour ago, Leisa said:

Being a submissive should never be a role that’s like a jacket you can take on or off. Being good submissive is not something that is learned but instead part of who you are as a person. I guess you don’t realize that being a submissive does not make one weak instead it makes someone strong and valued. If you don’t treat your submissive as a woman first and a submissive second than you’re doing things wrong. Being a submissive makes one strong and empowered, not weak and fragile. Maybe wanting a daughter who is weak of mind and body is what you’re trying to push off onto your own child who could end up ***d or worse in a vanilla as more *** happens in a vanilla relationship.

Leisa let us not become dogmatic like the vanilla world we are trying to escape. Not everyone wishes to be a lifestyle sub. Some just want to play a role during a scene, sexually or not. This is still valid and consensual BDSM. You cannot expect everyone to share your flavor of submission. Most things in life are learned, so yes you do learn how to be a sub. You didn't come out of the womb thinking "Imma sub. Imma sub." 

 

I agree that being a sub makes you strong and empowered however let us not play games you do not equate submission with strength. If you did, then as a sub you would be drawn to the strength of a sub but you couldn't give 2 kicks about a sub. You want the strength of a Dom because Dominance=Strength and power. There are no 2 ways to this. This equation is the centerpiece of our lifestyle and kink. No matter how much we wish to sugarcoat it. I am just honest enough to accept the raw reality of it and accept it. Hence, my reservations of not only my daughter but son being a sub. 

 

Also, I will repeat what I have mentioned before. Idealism, is a great concept in theory but reality trumps all things. I love BDSM and practice it, but I do not need to put down vanilla society in order to validate my choices. Before BDSM and vanilla relationships, God said let there be human nature. *** is rampant wherever you go. If it wasn't we wouldn't have all these articles and discussions about red flags and fake Doms and abusive subs. I think as good humans we should just oppose *** regardless of whether it is BDSM or vanilla. Characterizing vanilla society as boring/pretentious/*** ridden and BDSM as exciting/honest/*** free is just a false dichotomy.  BDSM and vanilla are just two sides to the same coin of human relationships. Neither are special and both can result in being extremely fulfilling and rewarding or empty, monotonous and vapid.  

48 minutes ago, Leisa said:

Being the mother of six wonderfully bright, open, loving children I decided to read through not just your original post but that of those who replied and your replies to them before offering my two cents because let’s face reality you’re going to take my opinion with a grain of salt because they disagree with yours. You said you wanted subs opinions yet I’ve seen time and again you invalidating and shutting down the subs opinions almost to the point of them being irrelevant.
As I said I have six children, two adults and four very young. I will first concentrate on the older two. I have seen my daughter go through more heartbreak in a vanilla world than I have gone through in the kink world. She’s been devalued and emotionally ***d by men (rather boys because real men do not devalue women) with whom she’s been involved. At 36 she’s the mother of two sons and sadly has been so disillusioned by men that she decided 5 years ago that she’d rather remain single then be treated horribly by another man. If I wasn’t in the middle of a custody battle for my four youngest during my divorce I’d sit her down and talk to her about the BDSM community and the diminished chances of her being used and ***d by a dominate who proclaimed to love her.
My oldest son, dead at the age of 29, I knew was different and I suspect was into the lifestyle but because I lived in a vanilla world at the time he did not feel comfortable enough to talk to me about his choices. This breaks my heart because instead of being his authentic self he likely felt that he had to pigeonhole himself into a vanilla relationship so as not to disappoint me. I will leave off the last four as they range from 5 - 11 (adopted) and are irrelevant to this conversation to the extent that they’re not ready to make life choices for themselves except if they decided to enter into this lifestyle lifestyle I’d absolutely help them navigate their choices the same I would if they opt to remain in the vanilla world.
I would not only encourage but assist any of my children through their decisions in life be it relationships, career choices, or life in general. I don’t know how I could do anything less. I have been in this lifestyle for many years and stepped away for many years to try to be vanilla to fit into the stereotypical stepford wife role because that’s what I felt my parents would want. Though my parents don’t know about my lifestyle as it’s never come up in conversation if asked I’d proudly tell them exactly what has made me the happiest.
My parents watched me go through two vanilla marriages that failed and the heartbreak those caused both to me and my exes. I have found that my two prior BDSM relationships left me stronger as not just a submissive but as a woman. You’re probably thinking just two; my first lasted 3 years until he decided he wanted more than I was able to give and my second lasted for 22 years before ending due to the current D/s relationship I’m in that he fully supports as i wanted more than he could give.
Being a submissive is not something I merely play at being its who I am. It’s not a role but rather my lifestyle. It’s what makes me happy and fulfilled. I’m looking at making life changing choices which will take me on a journey to join my Dominant and have to make the decision of whether to disclose or not disclose.
The answer is simple, if asked why I’m making these decisions I’d tell my mother without reservation. My father is a different story due mainly to his poor health. Regardless, my parents ultimate goal is for my happiness. I’m blessed to have a Dominant who loves and adores me. How can I want less for my children and still be a good role model and parent? We can only lead, guide, and direct our children to chase whatever it is that makes them happy. Frankly I’d rather have my children involved in this lifestyle than the vanilla world where the chances of being ***d are far greater than this lifestyle. I believe that what you have to ask yourself, rather than the rest of us, is does your hypocrisy help your children lead an authentic life or are you condemning them to the unpredictable vanilla world with its warped views on truth and honesty. Be blessed and best of luck on your parenting journey.

Leisa, disagreement does not mean I take your words with a grain of salt. I value your opinion very much. I'm actually happy that this post kind of got people talking. Which is what I wanted. I am open to being wrong in my approach or outlook. Me disagreeing with a sub does not mean I am shutting them down. If I invalidate something. Then that just might mean what that word means. That it is an invalid point. A sub may be the one to change my outlook. I don't know.

 

However, as I stated earlier. BDSM does not necessarily protect you from ***. Being smart, vigilant, cautious, and honestly base your approach on what Cade mentioned in another article as "Earning it." This Is what safeguards you the most from ***, vanilla or BDSM. 

 

Leisa, you have had an excellent experience in BDSM and the love and intimacy you speak of sounds great. However, you are lucky as are all the other subs who get Doms like yours because some come with the same level of submission that you have to a Dom who doesn't give a rat's ass. I am very suspicious of the world and the people in it, BDSM  or vanilla and giving yourself up in that way and being that *** should not be given away very easily or just to anyone. In the hands of a good Dom. Things are fine but what about when you have given every ounce of yourself and he never loved you? Then what? That level of devastation to me sounds far worse than a little vanilla breakup. 

 

I believe in leading an authentic life and hope that for my kids, but self preservation, dignity and respect will trump every other value and desire. You can go to the grave with your dignity and men respect you thousands of years later. Lost respect and tying yourself to the value of another means you will forever be forgotten in the shadows of another. Very serious ground to tread. 

[foreducatio]

9 minutes ago, little_red_92 said:

You are making assumptions here that TPE/TPT dynamics do not also value their sub. most of what you have said in response to others has stuck firm on your point, ignoring the perspective from both submissive, women and Dominants that justifiably disagree with your point. did you want our opinions? or more accurately i imagine, did you want us to agree with your hypocritical concept?

perhaps this post shows less about your wish to protect your daughter and more about your opinion in the BDSM scene and how it is expressed through the style of dynamics.

I never said anything about not valuing your sub in a TPE. I don't see why you couldn't value them. Ignoring a perspective is not the same as disagreement. Plus, I like to analyze things. So far, Cade and Leisa has made some excellent points that have really stood out to me. Also, I am not the only one who has shared this point. Read the responses We are  both safe, sane and consensual and I care deeply for my sub. So is there anything wrong here? I disagree is all. I don't want you to agree with anything. I wanted your opinions. I've disagreed and wrote responses. You may respond back. I appreciate your response.

 

And it is about whether I would want her to be a sub. People bring up various things to explain why this is wrong. That's ok. I just feel differently. 

[Deleted Member]

unfortunately i believe what you are saying without words is that you view submissive women ( and men) as lesser. nothing in your words say otherwise and a lot points towards a dangerous mentality. 
for reference i read your other post outlining your current relationship. Please read more about the lifestyle, learn more, experience more before you make a decision based on ignorance. 

[BeardedSi]

Right then.... it would seem someone has gotten on his high horse here and is yet to realise that he is sat on a donkey.

You are very stuck in your ways and don't seem to be listening to what people are telling you. Yes they are their opinions and you are entitled to your own. But for someone who's profile states they are here to learn you seem to be very resistant to others.

You have a very narrow view on submissives and can't seem to comprehend the strength that submissives truly have.

Yes there are abusive D/s dynamics, there are far more abusive vanilla relationships. You seem to have this idea that any D-type That was to become involved with your daughter would only *** her and strip her of her self. You think that all we are here to to is break them down. You are very mistaken. A phrase I heard early on in my journey and one that resonates with me is that one of my roles as a Dominant is to ensure that everyday my sub finishes the day being better than when it started. This is a concept that most D-types I have discussed with hold dearly to them. One question I think that needs to be asked is what do you think a Dominants role is?

[Deleted Member]

13 hours ago, foreducatio said:

I would not want my son to be a sub or slave. I want a strong willed and dominant son. And to add the other option I mentioned. I want a strong willed and dominant daughter. So I would be fine with her being a Mistress. 

Are you implying that subs can’t be strong willed and dominant? I choose to submit, it’s what I want and need and outside of that scenario I’m strong willed and dominant. I am fiercely independent, am able to look after myself, don’t call on others to fight my battles, have an opinion and am not afraid to voice it (as I’m doing now). 
 

I seriously think your understanding of subs and slaves is very skewed. Thinking we are weak and are not able to negotiate, make good choices and have a back bone is so wrong. Maybe you need to do some research before making statements like that. 

[Lillyth]

I would suggest that by being so closed to the idea of your daughter exploring her authentic self, wherever that may lead her, due to a need to protect her from the perceived horrors that she could face, you will inevitably push her away. She will be ***d to hide who she is from you if she feels you are against it, thus taking away your ability to protect her from or help her with any difficulties she may face which is ultimately what you appear to want to do. Also if, as you say, you have brought her up with good values and to know her own agency in this world, then you are going against those teachings by trying to hinder her living her own life authentically, and showing a lack of faith in these values by not allowing her to do so. She will inevitably find her own way, so you can either stand with her and be a constant, open haven of love and support or you can be kept at arms reach not knowing what she is facing.
A final point, from my understanding and experience so far, a relationship involving BDSM is far more deeper in terms of really knowing your partner than most vanilla relationships, not to mention the amount of communication that goes into it before you even become involved, I would much rather know my child knew exactly who they were committing to on the level that BDSM teaches than the superficial getting to know you techniques I see in a lot of vanilla relationships.

[foreducatio]

11 hours ago, Cade said:

I accept your premise.

I am not a submissive because my natural and most comfortable behavior is to be dominant. This is not a preference as much as a state of being, I think you'd agree. When put into any given situation, my inclination will be to behave in a logical manner according to this intrinsic design. I could have just as easily been a submissive had I learned and evolved from my life experiences in another fashion, it would make me no less, no more. The real power in each of us is to be ourselves.

There isn't necessarily something that turns me off about submitting, as much as, it doesn't arouse me. I know it may seem like the same thing, but for me - living the intrinsic design above, experiences are how I learn, give my ideas life, and yes, have devilish amounts of good times. What interactions I choose to create are tilted to my tastes. For me to feel passion for that experience it must arouse me. Submission doesn't turn me off; to the contrary, I find the very act extremely sexy. When applied to the same equation, a submissive just fulfilling their intrinsic design, secure in their identity just as I am mine, is incredibly powerful - thus the concept of "power exchange". A confident submissive, no matter what gender, is someone enriched by who they are and the interactions they decide to participate in.

These questions sort of lack any real context, but seem awfully romantic. Applying them to my life, I own a slave and would take as many whippings as it required. Kissing boots isn't my style, but if it was Death's own boot and I knew there was obviously no way for me to overcome the situation, I would kiss it. Kneeling for me is much tougher, but I'm getting old, and it's simply far too difficult to stand up straight after bending over...but again, to save my slave in this highly romantic concept of Death, himself, I would indeed bend knee. Proudly, as she earned her place in my world, and if I can petition the Grim Reaper for her life, I would. 

she serves me well, and is proud of the station she has earned with me. It gives her confidence, because she has no doubt in the knowledge she gained through our experiences. she finds happiness and contentment in her role. I fail to see any reason to consider her less than me, because she isn't, essentially. she is an extension of me: trained, branded and collared to prove her worthiness to represent me.

To consider her inferior would reflect my own inferiority.

Cade. I must admit, I like your points very much. I feel like we are 2 men standing across a gulf but can respectfully give a nod in disagreement. 

 

I agree to some degree. Yes it is a state of being and mostly aligns with your most natural state. However, if you preffered to be more submissive you could train yourself to do so. Some women are more dominant but they train themselves to become more submissive and it works. Typical Pavlov's dog conditioning. We are human and subject to the same psychology. Some people have been trampled all their life and desire more dominance and do develop as such. There is a reason subs are mostly female. Yes, I do think that society conditions men to be dominant and women to serve. Whether that is right or wrong is irrelevant and an argument for another day and lifetime. However, this is your society in a nutshell. Quite frankly the world. Check out Yemen. So yes I think as men we are predisposed to more dominant conditioning and naturally we veer off towards it because we also like it. 

 

This talk about real power in ourselves is excellent as a personal philosophy for goals and self development and career establishment, but let us be completely real here Cade. There is a man with a gun to your head and you are defenseless (in other words, ***) is the power really within you or is it in the hand of the man with the gun? THIS REAL distinction of vulnerability and power/strength is the center of our BDSM relationships. There are no sugar coatings as we like to pretend. You are not attracted to power and strength in your sub. If you were, then you'd ask your sub to slap you and dominate you but the truth is as you have admitted. "Submission doesn't turn" you off "on the contrary" you "find the act extremely sexy." I say the same thing. I just commit to the hard cold reality of what I just said instead of making it more palatable and politically correct. Also, weakness does not equate to inferiority. Just because you are weaker does not mean that you are irrelevant or inferior. I am sure there are many guys stronger and bigger than both you and I, but I do not conclude from us being weaker that we are inferior.

 

In my view, the idea that even vanilla relationships are not power dynamics are a farce. In every relationship, someone must submit more and the other take control and lead. In friendships, parent and child, student and teacher, coworkers. Power is ingrained in us and courses through our veins. The question is whether or not subs/slaves are really willing to accept their place and are Doms/Masters willing to accept theirs? Instead of pretending. 

 

It does have a contex. I was asking indirectly if you are the type of Master to give yourself over to your sub in such an intimate way? I can only respect what you have said. I agree wholeheartedly. That is true dedication. Now for reality, go show me how many Masters or Doms would necessarily say that with an honest heart? 

[foreducatio]

1 hour ago, LazyPiratesBounty said:

Smoking and hard *** aren't the same thing as being involved in bdsm though.

 

There are evil people both within bdsm and vanilla.

You want the best life for your daughter? Let her be whoever she is and love her for it.

Never said it was. I was merely saying hypocrisy isn't always necessarily bad. 

[foreducatio]

10 hours ago, Donnykinkster said:

You have to let your kids make their own way, choose their own path once they are of age. Try to stop them and that can actually push them away, close off to you even more. As we all know life can be tough and if you over protect for me you as a parent are not doing your job correctly. You have to let them stumble, make mistakes, otherwise how will they learn. As long as you are there to pick them up, brush them off and support them through these mistakes that's all you can do. this applies to life in general both vanilla and kink. I would much rather my daughter (29) felt she could come to me for ANY reason openly and without judgment to seek my view and advice than hide what she's up to or whom she's engaging with. We all make our own decisions and with that mistakes which hopefully we learn from, that for me has to be the same for our kids.

Donny. You are such a wise guy. I agree you must make them make their mistakes and yes I'd rather my daughter come to.me than just dive into BDSM. However, I still wouldn't promote it or want her to be a sub. Would be perfectly fine if she was a Mistress.

[TeeJay_98]

18 hours ago, foreducatio said:

Thanks for the response guys. I'm a Dom and I feel like I'm a good guy but I would never want my daughter to be a sub or a slave. It would literally go against everything I would invest years of teaching her. That you are valuable regardless of what others think about you. You should be an individual etc. I mean really, as a Man, what else do you teach your daughter? It's a weird spot to be in. 

So you want her to know that she is valuable and be an individual but her wanting to be valued and an individual goes against all that you are teaching her? 

 

Why do you feel that submissives are not valuable? Or an individual? What about this lifestyle makes you think that? Have you actually done any research into this lifestyle? 

 

Also... Has your daughter openly expressed  her wants to be involved in this lifestyle? I find it very strange that for someone very inexperienced in this lifestyle (yourself) to have such a strong and wrong opinion on what a submissive actually is... 

 

I reckon the best way to help yourself would be to do some research into the lifestyle and perhaps try and learn a little bit about submissives before making assumptions - it's just insulting. 

 

In my opinion... You should allow your children to become who they want to be and not tell them they are no longer valuable if they happen to choose a submissives journey. 

 

You of all people, as a parent... Should be encouraging your children and not indirectly belittling them and others who may be and probably are like them... ☺ 

Edited June 26, 2020 by TJ_Pup

[foreducatio]

58 minutes ago, little_red_92 said:

unfortunately i believe what you are saying without words is that you view submissive women ( and men) as lesser. nothing in your words say otherwise and a lot points towards a dangerous mentality. 
for reference i read your other post outlining your current relationship. Please read more about the lifestyle, learn more, experience more before you make a decision based on ignorance. 

I don't view them as lesser at all. I wouldn't care for my sub and want the best for her if I  viewed her as less. Dangerous mentality isn't my thing honestly. I'm not a big sadist. I'm more protective and nurturing than Sadistic. Contrary to what you think, I feel that given the nature of what we are doing, that subs should be even more careful and that Doms/Master should have to show more displays of committment before a sub gives herself that way. Not everyone may have excellent relationships/Doms like some of us here. And yes I am learning more, reading more and here I am talking more. Experience surely matters but it also makes a good case for authoritarianism but solid points based on logic and actual assessment can never be ignored. In the words of Aristotle "Follow the argument where it leads" Not follow the arguer where he goes. That is a flaw in logic. 

[Deleted Member]

You show a lot of faults in your understanding of BDSM.

Sadist is not a dangerous mentality.
Just because you have shown not commitment before a sub does not mean that a Dominant wouldn’t.

Im slightly fed up with your dismissal of my opinion. I’m a sub not YOUR sub, so kindly have some damn respect.

[Deleted Member]

23 minutes ago, foreducatio said:

Donny. You are such a wise guy. I agree you must make them make their mistakes and yes I'd rather my daughter come to.me than just dive into BDSM. However, I still wouldn't promote it or want her to be a sub. Would be perfectly fine if she was a Mistress.

Thank you but your a dom yes so that's going to mean you seek a submissive. That submissive is someone's daughter so i believe you have some thinking to do. I understand it's a difficult subject and when I saw it posted last night I knew it would garner some serious debate.  

[foreducatio]

1 hour ago, BeardedSi said:

Right then.... it would seem someone has gotten on his high horse here and is yet to realise that he is sat on a donkey.

You are very stuck in your ways and don't seem to be listening to what people are telling you. Yes they are their opinions and you are entitled to your own. But for someone who's profile states they are here to learn you seem to be very resistant to others.

You have a very narrow view on submissives and can't seem to comprehend the strength that submissives truly have.

Yes there are abusive D/s dynamics, there are far more abusive vanilla relationships. You seem to have this idea that any D-type That was to become involved with your daughter would only *** her and strip her of her self. You think that all we are here to to is break them down. You are very mistaken. A phrase I heard early on in my journey and one that resonates with me is that one of my roles as a Dominant is to ensure that everyday my sub finishes the day being better than when it started. This is a concept that most D-types I have discussed with hold dearly to them. One question I think that needs to be asked is what do you think a Dominants role is? 

I don't really think of myself in that way at all. As sitting on a high horse. And not sitting on a donkey doesn't mean anything either. 

 

I am here to learn but in learning, must I always agree with every conventional notion? Literally the only thing I said was that I wouldn't want my daughter to be a sub. That's it. From that, i am hearing so many far off deductions that just do not represent me at all or in fact anything I have already learned from all of you guys already. 

 

I do think subs are strong. You must be strong willed to not tear apart under punishments and following orders etc. Highly disciplined person. That takes some kind of internal strength to withstand this type of treatment. I learned this mostly from everyone here. 

No one is comparing levels of *** in BDSM to vanilla society. People keep bringing this up. It's not exactly relevant. I would not teach my daughter to easily open up in a vanilla relationship either. I think strong signs of respect, desire and love must first be seen prior to opening up. 

BeardedSi, how can I think that the Dom's role is to tear anyone down? I know at least from what I have read here and what others have encouraged me to do is to be someone who lifts their sub up. I subscribe to what you have said as well. The betterment of your sub is and should be one of our top priorities. 

 

So to answer your question. My perception of the Dom role is literally not very different from yours. It's probably identical. Protect, care, love (if you even love your sub) and fulfill your subs goals and desires in a safe, sane and consensual way. 

Yup I immersed myself in all that you guys taught me.🤷‍♂️ I'm just saying my daughter doing this would be a no for me. That's it.

 

[littlegirl-4745]

6 hours ago, Donnykinkster said:

On this I disagree, of course we must accept the choices our children make but their lives are always a parents business. That's what being a parent is, it's a lifelong commitment and that commitment doesn't stop just because they turn 18. I'm 51 and my Ma still frets, whittled about me, gives me a bollocking if I've been a dick etc 😊

But if you don't accept who your child is they won't want a relationship with you and will keep there business to themselves. You don't have to like what they do just be supportive and nurturing and there business will continue to be yours 🙂

[Deleted Member]

3 minutes ago, littlegirl-4745 said:

But if you don't accept who your child is they won't want a relationship with you and will keep there business to themselves. You don't have to like what they do just be supportive and nurturing and there business will continue to be yours 🙂

And thats exactly what I said in my original post. All I'm saying is when a child reaches 18 their lives are still a parents business. A parent never stops being just that. I make it clear that we must all make our own choices and mistakes 😊😊

[foreducatio]

27 minutes ago, little_red_92 said:

You show a lot of faults in your understanding of BDSM.

Sadist is not a dangerous mentality.
Just because you have shown not commitment before a sub does not mean that a Dominant wouldn’t.

Im slightly fed up with your dismissal of my opinion. I’m a sub not YOUR sub, so kindly have some damn respect.

Wow. Time out bud. I never said sadism is a dangerous mentality. S &M is what is primarily associated with physical punishment. We are all hyperaware about this aspect because one can very easily push pass consent, accidentally and truly hurt someone physically or emotionally.  So we give it a lot of attention. That's why I mentioned Sadism and should have clarified. But the other full blown dangerous aspects, like emotional and mental manipulation/real *** are also hard NOs for me and as I have learned here, is not real BDSM. 

 

Disagreement is not dismissal. I am not treating you as a sub. That would be poor etiquette and in poor taste as I have learned. 

Edited June 26, 2020 by foreducatio

[littlegirl-4745]

14 hours ago, foreducatio said:

I would not want my son to be a sub or slave. I want a strong willed and dominant son. And to add the other option I mentioned. I want a strong willed and dominant daughter. So I would be fine with her being a Mistress. 

So you're saying subs aren't strong willed?! 

Just because some people are submissive doesn't make them any less strong willed. A dom can be mistreated just as much as a sub in an unhealthy bdsm relationship. 

[Jolene79]

19 hours ago, Cade said:

Maybe, a slight change to the equation can help highlight the issue. What if your son wanted to be a sub or slave? Additionally, what if your son wanted a sub or slave? If you would be alright with either of these, but not your daughter, then I would definitely suggest exploring why you feel this way further before trying to en*** anything on anyone else - lest of all, your own child.

 

[helenOfToy]

3 hours ago, BeardedSi said:

Right then.... it would seem someone has gotten on his high horse here and is yet to realise that he is sat on a donkey.

You are very stuck in your ways and don't seem to be listening to what people are telling you. Yes they are their opinions and you are entitled to your own. But for someone who's profile states they are here to learn you seem to be very resistant to others.

You have a very narrow view on submissives and can't seem to comprehend the strength that submissives truly have.

Yes there are abusive D/s dynamics, there are far more abusive vanilla relationships. You seem to have this idea that any D-type That was to become involved with your daughter would only *** her and strip her of her self. You think that all we are here to to is break them down. You are very mistaken. A phrase I heard early on in my journey and one that resonates with me is that one of my roles as a Dominant is to ensure that everyday my sub finishes the day being better than when it started. This is a concept that most D-types I have discussed with hold dearly to them. One question I think that needs to be asked is what do you think a Dominants role is?

I have to say, I really like this attitude to Dominance, and I hope one day I find a Mistress who holds to the same values.

[Wo****]

@foreducatio

You value, respect and love submissives yet it's a no for your daughter?

You'd be happy if she was dominant but not if she was submissive?

I get that you want whats best for her but surely she knows better as to what she wants.

You're saying to her be free but you can't be this. You're putting conditions on it, ones that you don't follow. You have a submissive. You don't want her to be with a man like you?

[Mz_Whiplash]

After a discussion I read in real chat pertaining to this thread on this site.. I have felt a need to inject a few things .. and please .. come into chat and talk this though with me or anyone..  Your child has her/his own choices and steps in life to discover her *life path*, Now accept openness from a child to a parent to say how one may feel or need or want.. but do you personally think its ok to use this platform to address this on an open and public platform? .. I suggest to you.. that being a parent its your *one number one aim in life to get right* as your offspring demand it to get it right.. come into chat or seek professional guidance.. to do it right.. 

[Deleted Member]

5 hours ago, little_red_92 said:

You show a lot of faults in your understanding of BDSM.

Sadist is not a dangerous mentality.
Just because you have shown not commitment before a sub does not mean that a Dominant wouldn’t.

Im slightly fed up with your dismissal of my opinion. I’m a sub not YOUR sub, so kindly have some damn respect.

He didn’t say that sadism was a dangerous mentality. I haven’t seen him dismiss your opinion. He disagrees with it. Why are you taking offence when it hasn’t been given?

[Leisa]

5 hours ago, foreducatio said:

Cade. I must admit, I like your points very much. I feel like we are 2 men standing across a gulf but can respectfully give a nod in disagreement. 

 

I agree to some degree. Yes it is a state of being and mostly aligns with your most natural state. However, if you preffered to be more submissive you could train yourself to do so. Some women are more dominant but they train themselves to become more submissive and it works. Typical Pavlov's dog conditioning. We are human and subject to the same psychology. Some people have been trampled all their life and desire more dominance and do develop as such. There is a reason subs are mostly female. Yes, I do think that society conditions men to be dominant and women to serve. Whether that is right or wrong is irrelevant and an argument for another day and lifetime. However, this is your society in a nutshell. Quite frankly the world. Check out Yemen. So yes I think as men we are predisposed to more dominant conditioning and naturally we veer off towards it because we also like it. 

 

This talk about real power in ourselves is excellent as a personal philosophy for goals and self development and career establishment, but let us be completely real here Cade. There is a man with a gun to your head and you are defenseless (in other words, ***) is the power really within you or is it in the hand of the man with the gun? THIS REAL distinction of vulnerability and power/strength is the center of our BDSM relationships. There are no sugar coatings as we like to pretend. You are not attracted to power and strength in your sub. If you were, then you'd ask your sub to slap you and dominate you but the truth is as you have admitted. "Submission doesn't turn" you off "on the contrary" you "find the act extremely sexy." I say the same thing. I just commit to the hard cold reality of what I just said instead of making it more palatable and politically correct. Also, weakness does not equate to inferiority. Just because you are weaker does not mean that you are irrelevant or inferior. I am sure there are many guys stronger and bigger than both you and I, but I do not conclude from us being weaker that we are inferior.

 

In my view, the idea that even vanilla relationships are not power dynamics are a farce. In every relationship, someone must submit more and the other take control and lead. In friendships, parent and child, student and teacher, coworkers. Power is ingrained in us and courses through our veins. The question is whether or not subs/slaves are really willing to accept their place and are Doms/Masters willing to accept theirs? Instead of pretending. 

 

It does have a contex. I was asking indirectly if you are the type of Master to give yourself over to your sub in such an intimate way? I can only respect what you have said. I agree wholeheartedly. That is true dedication. Now for reality, go show me how many Masters or Doms would necessarily say that with an honest heart? 

Foreducatio you have so much to learn about women, submissives, and Dominates in general. To refer to women as the weaker sex is insulting and degrading to not just myself and other subs but to your own daughter. Having served in the military and having gone through hand to hand combat training there are quite a few men who I could put on their ass if I so desired. Being physically weaker does not equate to a lessor women. The only thing you may have meant was that subs are mentally strong. Physical strength in a person fades while mental strength continues to grow. You say you want your child(ren) to be the dominant in the relationship. As the weaker vessel does that not put your daughter equally at risk of being injured or hurt? After all she will be dealing with a submissive who could be physically stronger than she is.

Let’s move on to your claim that anyone can be trained to be something or someone they’re not. First you need to read up on the Pavlov’s dog theory you kind of have it wrong and go by the understanding of society instead of the reason behind the study in the first place. Such is irrelevant. You cannot “train” someone to be something other than who and what they are. You cannot take a submissive, male or female, and turn them into a dominant personality any more than you can take a dominant personality and turn it submissive. But wait you don’t want to make your daughter into a submissive just everyone else’s daughter. By your reasoning your daughter is to naturally be a submissive and would have to be “trained” to be something other than who she was meant to be. It makes one wonder, if your child was a member of the LBGTQ+ would you try to train them to be straight. According to your own words you can train anyone to fit into any stereotype simply to fit what you deem acceptable. I keep trying to come up with even one point you make to be on your side as a parent but I simply cannot. Your views are so misguided as to reflect poorly upon a community you want to become part of. I understand you’re extremely new and green to the whys and what fors of this lifestyle but maybe this lifestyle just isn’t for you. Aren’t you supposed to be setting the example for your children? If this is the example you’re setting you are doing not just my community a disservice but your children also. My advice is this — regardless of whatever your children want to be, regardless of the lifestyle they live, accept them as people, accept them as individuals who know their own mind and are strong because they do. Anything less does a great disservice to them as individuals who you’ve raised to be strong of mind and will.

[Phoenyx]

I suspect that the answer to this question, comes down to the specific situation.  What is the style and quality of the Dom (or even Domina) that the daughter brings home?  I'm certain that most parents here, have enough "Scene" experience, to make that judgement.

It appears to have been forgotten, that the best D-types, typically started-out as S-types.  It was how they gained empathy.  Even professional dominance training begins with being trained as a slave.  That slave training may last just a week, or even, only a couple days.  Still, it is pretty intense.  But then, I may be "old school" in that respect.

Of course, a parent must also consider their daughter's approach to submission.  As a Dom, I have a hard and fast rule along that line.  More than once, I have stated plainly: "You must prove that you can serve yourself, before I deem you worthy to serve me."  That means having one's own life, and one's own means of support.  I am not a "lifer"; never have been (that 24/7 thing).  Nor, am I a "Sugar Daddy".  Still, a potential sub or slave is offering a large portion of their life to me.  I wish to share in that life, and grow from it, just as they do.  I even admire dominant traits, and I almost always encourage them.  This may even lead to eventual dominance training, if the slave wishes to take that next step.  I enjoy watching them grow.  Sure, this could lead to an inevitable parting of the ways.  But, we would be parting as lifelong friends.

Still, there are those Doms, whose behavior appears totally reprehensible.  We have all encountered these types.  They believe that the only true sub, is one that is weak and naïve.  Such a slave must unconditionally submit to whatever *** is hurled their way.  Any statement counter to these views, either from a sub or from another Dom, is seen as a personal attack.  These "Doms" react with anger, insults, and claims that their way is "the only true BDSM".  They are every parent's worst nightmare.  Yet, too often, they appear to be in the majority, simply because they shout louder and longer than everyone else.

All in all, I hope that this provides some clarity to this question.  There is no simple, universal answer.  It is just like the rest of life---each step must be taken as it comes.  When sitting with a child, discussing "The Birds and the Bees", just how do you respond to the question: "But, where do the whips and leather come in?"