Leisa Posted July 2, 2020 Posted July 2, 2020 18 hours ago, Mavman said: Mm, hate breeds hate. Hate s***ch not legal if incitement to crime, or oppression of others or single other. Unfortunately you’re wrong about all but one of your statements the others are wrong. It’s incites a riot, can result in bodily *** to others (cannot scream Fire in a crowded area such as a theatre), cannot be such that you *** immediate bodily *** to self
Deleted Member Posted July 2, 2020 Author Posted July 2, 2020 Ah, well, USA law is different from UK Law, and other Laws apply in other countries...
Ky**** Posted July 3, 2020 Posted July 3, 2020 maybe I'm still coming to terms with my own identity but I still get a little nervous about what's often branded transphobia. I was born physically male, I'm now mentally a woman. However, I do not agree with those who argue that I have the right to use women's spaces just because of how I identify. Unfortunately I've still got the male equipment so would not label anyone transphobic who argued that I have no right to expose those male bits to women in changing rooms. If someone has the op that's different but until then I think its reasonable to insist that male equipment restricts you from being naked among females without their consent.
ey**** Posted July 3, 2020 Posted July 3, 2020 54 minutes ago, Kymi said: I have no right to expose those male bits to women in changing rooms Some of this I feel is not my place - but also. For the best part you wouldn't be exposing yourself. It's why there's, well, cubicles. I guess to think this way. If hormone pills had made you more femme in appearance, and you were wearing make up in public and boobs had grown a little. Which changing room, toilets, etc do you use? And I feel that's an issue in itself.
Deleted Member Posted July 8, 2020 Author Posted July 8, 2020 Freedom of s***ch should never EVER be restricted. From there its a VERY slippery slope to totalitarianism. Be careful what you wish for. Freedom of s***ch is the cornerstone of every western democracy. The most free, fair prosperous places ever.
Deleted Member Posted July 8, 2020 Author Posted July 8, 2020 Censoring people is always a bad thing. Its only when all views are free to be spoken that we can weed out the appealing ideas and the good ones. Last week someone attempted to get my thrown off this site as I do not belive trans women are real women. I have no issue with anyone to live their life how they want, unfortunately these days if you have the wrong opinion, even when it's backed up by science. People want to get you cast into room 101. Thank you :-D
Phoenyx Posted July 9, 2020 Posted July 9, 2020 7 hours ago, Thir***point7 said: People want to get you cast into room 101 George Orwell, "1984". The purpose of Room 101 is not to be confused with one of our "fun" rooms.
Deleted Member Posted July 9, 2020 Author Posted July 9, 2020 10 hours ago, Thir***point7 said: Censoring people is always a bad thing. You miss my point. It's not about "censoring people" but more about self censoring. Making a decision to withhold opinion not for *** of backlash but because that opinion may cause others who we really know nothing about deep emotional *** especially in an area like this where. unless you are trans yourself you cannot even begin.to understand how it feels.
Deleted Member Posted July 9, 2020 Author Posted July 9, 2020 10 hours ago, Thir***point7 said: Freedom of s***ch should never EVER be restricted. From there its a VERY slippery slope to totalitarianism. Be careful what you wish for. Freedom of s***ch is the cornerstone of every western democracy. The most free, fair prosperous places ever. When it becomes hate s***ch then Yes it should be rejected and those who speak it should be excluded and isolated
Deleted Member Posted July 9, 2020 Author Posted July 9, 2020 10 hours ago, Thir***point7 said: Last week someone attempted to get my thrown off this site as I do not belive trans women are real women. Yet in their minds they are very "real" women. Real is only perception of the individual.
Deleted Member Posted July 9, 2020 Author Posted July 9, 2020 On 7/3/2020 at 11:29 AM, eyemblacksheep said: Some of this I feel is not my place - And this @Thir***point7Is exactly my point. Yes there is freedom of s***ch but is it always our place to pass opinion? Not for me and not anymore. Up until a few months ago I would have agreed with everything you say but not anymore.
Deleted Member Posted July 9, 2020 Author Posted July 9, 2020 But again I feel I must say I would argue the toss all day long for you and your right to an opinion BUT only to a certain point.
Jinxy Posted July 9, 2020 Posted July 9, 2020 In my opinion, freedom of s***ch gets confused with freedom of s***ch without consequences. You have free will. Therefore, you also have the freedom to say what you feel you need to express. But the idea that everyone else should then just sit back and have no rebuttal or action for or against your statement is ludicrous. We do not exist in a vacuum. Every action will have a reaction, whether positive or negative. These reactions could be legal, social, emotional, etc in nature. That’s why it’s important to assess whether the consequences of expressing your right to free s***ch are worth it to you. If the consequences are not ones you’re willing to accept, that is where taking personal responsibility needs to come in with self-censorship.
Deleted Member Posted July 9, 2020 Author Posted July 9, 2020 1 hour ago, Jinxy said: These reactions could be legal, social, emotional, etc in nature. That’s why it’s important to assess whether the consequences of expressing your right to free s***ch are worth it to you. Yet the problem remains that some just don't care or they actually take pleasure in hurting others, no empathy and these are the ones that should be actively identified and shunned by all right minded folk
ey**** Posted July 9, 2020 Posted July 9, 2020 3 hours ago, Donnykinkster said: Yet in their minds they are very "real" women. Real is only perception of the individual. It's complex and something I don't fully understand. But I accept. I can't understand Korean either, but I know it's a real language. There is actually a lot of science and history that backs up Trans, non binary, gender fluid, so on. (Just as there's science, history, etc. that backs up that the Earth is round or that climate change is real - but yet there's still folk who deny both) There's also that - when you look at someone you can see their appearances - but you can't actually see their chromosomes - and what influence that has had if any. Because when you really get into that it's complex. The other thing : whether trans women (or trans men) are "real" or not has largely no impact on our lives.
Dzydove Posted July 12, 2020 Posted July 12, 2020 I am a cis female. I have four ***. Three are transgender. I have a trans *** and cousin as well. I never would have guessed four years ago that this was possible. However, life is what it is. I love my babies no matter what. They aren't crazy. They are good people. It's taught me a lot about acceptance and my siblings have had to learn it as well. My *** are loved and any family member who doesn't accept them isn't a part of my life. Or theirs. If you don't believe it's real, that on you. While biology says male is male and female is female, the studies I've seen shows that a trans woman born a boy has a brain that thinks like a girl. I see it as a birth defect. Obviously genetic in my mind. I will of course respect your right to express your opinion, but please understand that there's more to this world than we could ever possibly know. And while it's been mentioned, I've NEVER heard of a trans person being a child molester. They don't go to the bathroom to attack your babies. Or wives. My mother beloved that gay men were philes. All of them. She also beloved that black men were a danger to white women. Antiquated false beliefs that have no place in our society. I hope the uninformed beliefs about trans people will disappear soon. I just exercised my right to free s***ch to give my personal story to those who think differently. That's what free s***ch is for.
Deleted Member Posted July 12, 2020 Author Posted July 12, 2020 (edited) 31 minutes ago, Dzydove said: I am a cis female. I have four ***. Three are transgender. I have a trans *** and cousin as well. I never would have guessed four years ago that this was possible. However, life is what it is. I love my babies no matter what. They aren't crazy. They are good people. It's taught me a lot about acceptance and my siblings have had to learn it as well. My *** are loved and any family member who doesn't accept them isn't a part of my life. Or theirs. If you don't believe it's real, that on you. While biology says male is male and female is female, the studies I've seen shows that a trans woman born a boy has a brain that thinks like a girl. I see it as a birth defect. Obviously genetic in my mind. I will of course respect your right to express your opinion, but please understand that there's more to this world than we could ever possibly know. And while it's been mentioned, I've NEVER heard of a trans person being a child molester. They don't go to the bathroom to attack your babies. Or wives. My mother beloved that gay men were philes. All of them. She also beloved that black men were a danger to white women. Antiquated false beliefs that have no place in our society. I hope the uninformed beliefs about trans people will disappear soon. I just exercised my right to free s***ch to give my personal story to those who think differently. That's what free s***ch is for. Where I live there is a garage where I often refuel the car, anyway one of the people behind the counter is either trans or a crossdresser and this person is a very manly looking type. Yet I can see this person wears the dress and wig with pride and for me along with that comes masses of courage. Where i live trust me it takes bottle to do this and to make the choice to be who thay are. I always make a point when I pay this person for my fuel of saying words like " Thank you sweetheart, cheers luv" as thats my way of saying "I see you, I respect you and the person you are" this person always looks at me with I don't know maybe gratitude for my willingness to accept who they are with zero judgment. It sickens me to think that this person probably faces every single day some form of spite and if I saw or heard this I would go into full on monster mode. A couple of weeks ago I chatted with a young trans person and what this person said really bothered me and has been on my mind ever since. It opened my eyes to the fact that even here, a place where I think we are much more accepting of others there is still some level of phobia and again that bothers me. For me your post is what we need, we need more like you to step out if the shadows and say "this is what I am." I know and understand how hard this can be but those like you must dig deep and display courage to try and educate not so much those like me but maybe others who may not be as willing to try and understand, we need to be educated and only folks like you can do this. I can assure you should you choose to do this, step out proudly I will always stand with you against those who may deem themselves worthy of judgment and I feel there are many like me from what I have seen. I thank you for the courage you show in your words and I am with you 😁😁😊😊 Edited July 12, 2020 by Deleted Member Spelling
ol**** Posted July 12, 2020 Posted July 12, 2020 Freedom of s***ch and freedom of expression, which keeps being mentioned in this thread, are much the same thing for me. Somebody upthread ,Jinxy I think, said that freedom of s***ch comes with consequences. Yes it does. As long as the consequence remain as (relatively) civilised debate than all is well with society. However if it spills over into action of any sort then society has a problem. Part of that problem for me is a lot of people today feel they have a right to be offended, not for themselves, but on behalf of others. That's almost as bad. My current slogan, OK cheap and trite, I fully understand, when folks tell me that Black Lives Matter is to point out that all lives matter. That does not mean I don't think we don't need to level up society, of course we do. An example of the world we live in cropped up only today. I was on FB this morning. There was a not very nice post that suggested that false allegations should be punished by a jail term. A lot of my friends, both male and female seemed to agree. For, I hope, obvious reasons it gave me pause for thought. Needless to say I didn't comment.
Deleted Member Posted July 12, 2020 Author Posted July 12, 2020 Thursday at 04:13 AM, Donnykinkster said: When it becomes hate s***ch then Yes it should be rejected and those who speak it should be excluded and isolated I’m not sure I agree. Who decides it is hate s***ch? You mentioned JK Rowling in this post I think. She’s been accused of hate s***ch. Should she be restricted from having an opinion? And whatever you think about her opinions, it does seem that she encounters more violent reaction than a man does if he espouses a similar opinion.
Deleted Member Posted July 12, 2020 Author Posted July 12, 2020 3 hours ago, oldfellow said: Freedom of s***ch and freedom of expression, which keeps being mentioned in this thread, are much the same thing for me. Somebody upthread ,Jinxy I think, said that freedom of s***ch comes with consequences. Yes it does. As long as the consequence remain as (relatively) civilised debate than all is well with society. However if it spills over into action of any sort then society has a problem. Part of that problem for me is a lot of people today feel they have a right to be offended, not for themselves, but on behalf of others. That's almost as bad. My current slogan, OK cheap and trite, I fully understand, when folks tell me that Black Lives Matter is to point out that all lives matter. That does not mean I don't think we don't need to level up society, of course we do. An example of the world we live in cropped up only today. I was on FB this morning. There was a not very nice post that suggested that false allegations should be punished by a jail term. A lot of my friends, both male and female seemed to agree. For, I hope, obvious reasons it gave me pause for thought. Needless to say I didn't comment. You’re missing the point. By saying Black Lives Matter, no-one is saying that All lives don’t matter. They’re saying that Black Lives carry less importance and value in terms of police *** (as an example) and until they have equal value - All Lives Matter is an empty statement.
Deleted Member Posted July 12, 2020 Author Posted July 12, 2020 11 minutes ago, Curvykate said: I’m not sure I agree. Who decides it is hate s***ch? You mentioned JK Rowling in this post I think. She’s been accused of hate s***ch. Should she be restricted from having an opinion? And whatever you think about her opinions, it does seem that she encounters more violent reaction than a man does if he espouses a similar opinion. I know, it's a real tough one and something maybe we will never have an answer where all are happy. Yep she has Defo received more grief than I think a man would but that for me is because maybe it's perceived that as a woman she should have a better understanding of the issues faced here.
Deleted Member Posted July 12, 2020 Author Posted July 12, 2020 2 minutes ago, Donnykinkster said: I know, it's a real tough one and something maybe we will never have an answer where all are happy. Yep she has Defo received more grief than I think a man would but that for me is because maybe it's perceived that as a woman she should have a better understanding of the issues faced here. It’s ok that she got death threats and *** because she didn’t agree with an ideology? Because we are talking about a very smart woman. She understands the issues.
Deleted Member Posted July 12, 2020 Author Posted July 12, 2020 Just now, Curvykate said: It’s ok that she got death threats and *** because she didn’t agree with an ideology? No where did I say that?
Deleted Member Posted July 12, 2020 Author Posted July 12, 2020 4 minutes ago, Donnykinkster said: No where did I say that? “Is because that as a woman she should have had a better understanding” I’m not saying you agree with that *** but that it’s a justification for others to *** her
Deleted Member Posted July 12, 2020 Author Posted July 12, 2020 24 minutes ago, Curvykate said: it does seem that she encounters more violent reaction than a man does if he espouses a similar opinion. Hmmm it was you who raised this point not I, I just Said it was because some perceive her sex as a reason to have a better understanding rather than a man. Basically confirming that which you insinuated.
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