Context of words is key. A slight retraction and apology.

[Deleted Member]

Ive come to realise especially the last couple of weeks my errors in using certain phrases or words and how they, taken out of context could be deemed offensive. Those who i could have offended however have met my ignorance only with patience, zero anger and to be honest friendliness. I feel a slight retraction is needed with some clarity.

 

I have used the word "doormat" a couple of times but in a certain context and context is as I've found out so so important.

 

I first must say that someday I may even want a doormat of my own, a submissive who will do whatever i choose however i choose and yes that may include wiping my feet on her as that's what a doormat is after all.

 

However my "doormat" will be a woman who knows all the options available to her, she will not be new to the community, she will understand perfectly there are many different routes she could take as a submissive. She will have knowledge of herself and be able through chat to show me she is of sound mind and fully understands the commitment she may make. She must convince me first that this route is the one she chooses so I can comfortably then wipe my feet, I know she in her own mind craves this style of submission so no when i say doormat i do not say stupid or foolish but maybe uneducated to the WHOLE reality of what submission could be. Total respect to all who choose this level.of submission and  I might quite fancy getting me one of those myself someday BUT she will show me first she understands and chooses freely.

 

What worries me and what I truly mean about a doormat and weak Doms is this. I mean no offence but this is how I see it.

 

A new lass, new to the community and a little naive. No experience so no control to base whom she meets and how they behave. She's naive and she is ***, ideal for some doormat training I think. I can spot this vulnerability from a mile off so I imagine others can too, it's like a beacon to some and this is what concerns me a touch.

 

She meets a man and from the off he's a bit of a twat , he treats her with no respect, does nothing to broaden her knowledge, keeps her in a place where she only knows one way, his way. He crushes the girl she is to be replaced by something else, he convinces her she is worthless and with that she becomes his doormat. She's not aware she has different options, he won't allow her to see this so to her his way really is the only way. He trains her to be his doormat, it's normal, surely this is what submission is, the same for all but she doesn't know any different does she as he has not allowed her to see. Is that her fault? Not at all as she knows no different and it sickens me slightly to know there are those who experience this type of D/s without being offered the full picture of what submission can actually be. No it's not her fault but it really is someone's and I think that's pretty obvious, this is where my use of the word "weak" comes from.

 

 It's not meant at all for shall we say a "No limits" or CNC relationship, these can take years to build up to and yes the sub may at the end of that be the best doormat the world has ever seen. Yet I have no doubts this type of doormat will be fully informed, wise to the different paths she could choose yet still chooses this one. There are doormats and there are doormats, I hope that clarifies what I actually meant.

 

This post is NOT a pop at anyone or a criticism, just an observation and in a way an apology for my thoughtless words without explanation. As I say a doormat in time may be a route I take but she will be a wise doormat who carries knowledge.

 

Primal thoughts

D

[Deleted Member]

I think that word should be used lightly and even in private between the sub and her Dom, It’s a heavy word which carry loads of bad connotations and possible trigger. If a sub want yo use then it’s up to her, but Doms should only use it in a specific context like part of their kink list for example. I have seen so many women coming into submission escaping *** vanilla relationship and wanting to play that card to obtain at the end an aftercare who would make their last experience, hopefully a dim light into their memories. A “rag doll” type of submission is rewarding for both sides if it carries the full respect and undeniable care.

[Deleted Member]

On 7/18/2020 at 3:23 PM, FabSeverus said:

A “rag doll” type of submission is rewarding for both sides if it carries the full respect and undeniable care.

Completely agree 😊

[Deleted Member]

On 7/18/2020 at 3:23 PM, FabSeverus said:

It’s a heavy word which carry loads of bad connotations and possible trigger. 

A fair comment and I see your point.

[na****]

46 minutes ago, FabSeverus said:

I think that word should be used lightly and even in private between the sub and her Dom, It’s a heavy word which carry loads of bad connotations and possible trigger. If a sub want yo use then it’s up to her, but Doms should only use it in a specific context like part of their kink list for example. I have seen so many women coming into submission escaping *** vanilla relationship and wanting to play that card to obtain at the end an aftercare who would make their last experience, hopefully a dim light into their memories. A “rag doll” type of submission is rewarding for both sides if it carries the full respect and undeniable care.

I agree with this point completely, I don't think it's a phrase That should be publicly chucked around.. 

[Deleted Member]

On 7/18/2020 at 4:10 PM, Rockchicknat said:

I agree with this point completely, I don't think it's a phrase That should be publicly chucked around.. 

Yet if said in the right context with a clear explanation of that context almost any word or subject can be discussed openly here. If respect is shown and there is no spite intended self censorship is personal choice and something i have thought much on the last few days. As stated certain words can have triggers for others, but what do I do, they are not my triggers. Yes if I err in the use of my words I try to learn a little but that will not stop me from using the word again but if said, it will cause offence for no one

Edited July 18, 2020 by Deleted Member
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[na****]

In realistic terms I suppose as far as fetishes go, then yes definitley anything can be discussed... We are all adults and make our own choices.. But yes context definitley has its place.. I believe timing is the key as well. 

[Deleted Member]

i would like to say whilst i have no particularly helpful comments to make on your post, i highly respect you for admitting your ignorance and above all learning from it. i thoroughly enjoy reading your rhetoric in the forum threads and believe they always bring out valid and sometimes enlightening points that people had not considered, even those who have been in the lifestyle for some time. 

Perhaps the only thing i could add is that, to be called a doormat of my Dominant would bring no shame or negative thoughts. To be called a doormat in general would be met with anger and belligerence. 

We can say things without compassion to the triggers of others, or perhaps we can censor our words to be sensitive to all triggers, education level and sensibilities. neither works all the time and both only work depending on the subject. Acknowledging the potential for triggers and continuing on, with the ability to then back up ideas, arguments and narratives despite offense is a difficult thing

 

So, Thank you @Donnykinkster  for once again highlighting the journey one takes in self responsibly and education :)

[on****]

No, you're post doesn't clarify anything and does quite the opposite in fact. 

Stop saying the word doormat. If you feel the need to use a word that requires so much explaining in terms of context, and even when you have "explained" it and it still doesn't make sense and causes offence then think twice before ever saying it again

[Deleted Member]

Just now, oneminusone said:

No, you're post doesn't clarify anything and does quite the opposite in fact. 

Stop saying the word doormat. If you feel the need to use a word that requires so much explaining in terms of context, and even when you have "explained" it and it still doesn't make sense and causes offence then think twice before ever saying it again

i feel that perhaps you are missing the point. the history and the context of this post. 
 

[Deleted Member]

On 7/18/2020 at 10:38 PM, oneminusone said:

No, you're post doesn't clarify anything and does quite the opposite in fact. 

Stop saying the word doormat. If you feel the need to use a word that requires so much explaining in terms of context, and even when you have "explained" it and it still doesn't make sense and causes offence then think twice before ever saying it again

. You don't seem to understand and that's ok, not evwrybody is meant to., the post wasn't for you and whether you understand or not makes no difference. Thank you for your kind, helpful input and I shall.give it some thought.

[Deleted Member]

On 7/18/2020 at 10:38 PM, oneminusone said:

 and it still doesn't make sense and causes offence then think twice before ever saying it again

It does make sense to myself and those it was intended for and thinking twice was the WHOLE point of the thread, I'm.not surprised you can't see that through your blatant hostility but if that's what you want, you have come to the right place

 

[Mo****]

@Donnykinkster

Mate I do not, at this point in my life, want a doormat. I want a partner who has an open mind and a willingness to experiment and explore, both herself and situations.  I am NOT going to worry too much about other's triggers, because if I did, then there would be very little that I could say that would have no effect on someone else.  That is just an unfortunate situation in life, and should someone challenge me for using an unknown trigger to them on what I say or write, then I will apologise, but I will not change.  However I will change my conversations with THEM, so as not to aggravate a situation.  If I worried about what may trigger someone, then I would not be able to talk or write at all, because everyone is different with their emotions and feelings.

Don't all write and say I am wrong, because if you think about it, you will see I am right.  I am not being mean, nasty or intentionally dismissive of anyone's feelings, but with billions of people in this world, how can I not hit someone's trigger without knowing it.

Donny, I am with you about what a submissive might want, in being a doormat, and if she/he so chooses that for themselves, then I will support their right in having that life, but at this point in time, that is not what I want.  I do NOT think lowly of anyone who chooses that life for themselves, so long as it is an informed choice.  I do NOT think any submissive is weak!

[Deleted Member]

On 7/19/2020 at 4:56 AM, MossyBoy said:

@Donnykinkster

  I do NOT think any submissive is weak!

Neither do I, i never have. The word "weak" for me is for those who would maipulate a young naive submissive into believing this is the only way. Subs are built of steel, they are the real strength behind any D/s relationship and I wouldn't have it any other way.

Edited July 19, 2020 by Deleted Member
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[Deleted Member]

On 7/18/2020 at 6:55 PM, little_red_92 said:

 

 

So, Thank you @Donnykinkster  for once again highlighting the journey one takes in self responsibly and education

No, thank you Little red, your words on triggers really are something to think about and that I will do. This is what I meant about my ignorance mainly being met with kindness and that's what really impresses  me about this community, again you have my thanks 😊

Edited July 19, 2020 by Deleted Member
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[Deleted Member]

On 7/19/2020 at 4:56 AM, MossyBoy said:

 

 

Don't all write and say I am wrong

Even if I did I would not say that. I would enquire to try and work out how we see things differently. Others views and opinions are the one thing I value above all others on this site. Plus I think now in many ways there is no wrong or right just and agreement between two people whatever that may be 

Edited July 19, 2020 by Deleted Member

[Deleted Member]

3 hours ago, MossyBoy said:

  I am NOT going to worry too much about other's triggers, because if I did, then there would be very little that I could say that would have no effect on someone else. If I worried about what may trigger someone, then I would not be able to talk or write at all, because everyone is different with their emotions and feelings

It’s true you are free to say whatever you want after all it’s a fetish site. And it’s true that some submissive are happy to be used as such either with their Dom or any men. 
but there are two major triggers that are associated with vanilla life and some women or men have been affected for years, and doormat/***. So maybe sometime we could think before saying it without a proper context. 
I know on the other site there are groups that would upset lots of people on here because there are no barrier except for *** and ***s. Anything else’s is open to blatantly say. And I am talking about really dark and disturbing for some. But that’s fetish site about. 
myself have been practicing role play with but I won’t put it on my profile because it’s not what I am about, there is more than this scenario. I don’t want to be defined just by it. 
 
you are free to say on your profile that you are looking for a doormat or raping a sub but you might not get many messages.... 

[Cade]

A lot of the issue is about misrepresentation, I believe. As pointed out, on a personal level you can call your partner anything that works for you and your partner; it's when we try to represent the whole by those same "private" terms that it becomes a problem. As we all already know every individual, every relationship, every dynamic is different - often based on the mutual experiences those individuals involved have had. We can all understand that there are terms and phrases that carry stigma (which for some may be positive, and for others, negative). It's out of respect that we consider the words we use, to keep from causing damage to or offending ideas greater than ourselves.

For me, I want to own a slave, not doormat. The difference is significant in my opinion: the slave flourishes in their total subservience, growing and evolving in their submission that strengthens their identity creating personal happiness for that individual through ownership of self; whereas a doormat just lays there and accepts whatever happens to them, often existing in a state of lonely vapidness, unable to escape a fate they feel powerless to change - being stepped on by whomever. A BDSM slave is a stunning creature of sublime intrinsic fortitude, a doormat is mostly taken advantage of and discarded once used up or redundant. I concede, these are just how I define the two, which may well reflect only my understanding.

@Donnykinkster The ability to examine our own actions and decisions, identifying places we can improve ourselves, and then being consistent to change for the better is an admirable quality. By endeavoring this arduous task, you are doing a grand service to yourself and the community. So, I say thank you for demonstrating that dominance is about respect.

[Deleted Member]

35 minutes ago, Cade said:

For me, I want to own a slave, not doormat.

It doesn’t have to be necessary associated with a slave sub type. Could be any. A babygirl might want at some point of her dynamic fantasise and experience that state. A submissive can be a doormat at any time and can be a play thing. When it’s get to the point of a real status then maybe it’s not healthy unless it’s got a purpose to it. And I doubt many Dom have the expertise to handle the thin line. It’s a risk psychologically. 
degrading and *** is a good start for practicing, learning the sub reaction and slowly take it to the doormat level. Objectification could also affect the Dom psyche and turn into an addiction, and might slowly alter his vision on women if it’s a young Dom. 
i remember a friend on another site who post a picture of herself with a black eye and she stir a rage with other  women because she advertised *** toward women, they all missed her point she tried to make!

as you said Cade it’s about misinterpretation but also what people experienced in vanilla world.... 

[Wo****]

Maybe it's just that the word "doormat" has negative connotations, even in the vanilla word.

It describes someone weak, or someone that gets used, taken advantage of....

In bdsm it's a consensual thing. The "doormat" isn't weak. The opposite in fact.

 

Some words, especially in the vanilla world, they represent something else...

Call me a slut in the vanilla world and it's an insult, call me a slut because I'm a slut with you in bdsm and it's an endearment.

 

 

[Deleted Member]

12 hours ago, oneminusone said:

No, you're post doesn't clarify anything and does quite the opposite in fact. 

Stop saying the word doormat. If you feel the need to use a word that requires so much explaining in terms of context, and even when you have "explained" it and it still doesn't make sense and causes offence then think twice before ever saying it again

Maybe Donny will fall of his chair when he read that, but I back him on that he clarified perfectly about his notion of doormat, and refute that he wanted to offend by using that word....his explanation wasn't an excuse from his part but opening the dialogue about why people use it wrongly or don't understand the impact of using that word.

cordially....

[Si****]

I sometime thing people enjoy being offended. They read something they don't like but instead of moving on and finding something else to read, they stick around and try to change others with defending their offence. Its just masochistic.

I can stand watching the news, why would i tune in to it knowing i don't like it.

[Cade]

@FabSeverus Agreed, which illustrates my point: at a personal level, you can use whatever terms you want to describe your partner, as you and your partner is aware of the context. Obviously, no one outside your dynamic can understand that context not being privy to what you and your partner share. However, in that same token, you shouldn't apply that personal term as a definition for the entire collective of any role.

I respect your right to call/treat your partner in any consensual way; you respect that not everyone is the same as your partner, don't share the same dynamic as you, and likely doesn't consent to be considered in the same fashion. This is how this should work, right?

[Deleted Member]

I must admit I think for a lot of users on this site, this kind of thread seems cliquey. I think if this is a discussion between a core group of users (as I think several threads have been of late) could you not take it to a chat room? Because I’ve seen a comment suggesting someone doesn’t know the context and that this thread isn’t for them. That’s not very inclusive. I am one of those who is perhaps counted as a core member because I don’t shut up - erm, I con regularly 😳. But I’d hate to think that newbies and lurkers who make up the majority are feeling cliques-out. I’d quote but I can’t use the app atm and the mobile version of the site is...not very user friendly. 🤷🏻‍♀️

[Deleted Member]

12 minutes ago, Cade said:

This is how this should work, right?

Absolutely! 
we only to here share our point of view to give some insight for the less fortunate in experience or knowledge. To give them some base point for the right attitude. But this is sometime where it goes all wrong as Bounty mentioned, you can’t call anyone here slut just because you heard some subs likes to be called that way... 

Edited July 19, 2020 by Deleted Member
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