Opinions please - “Tapping Out”

[SammyB]

I have the wonderful pleasure  to chat to someone over the last couple of days 

It was one of those chats where many Ds and lifestyle conversations where had and it was fantastic to hear his thoughts and opinions on all sorts of subjects 

On a whole we were very much on the same page about most things 

When we came to chat about *** , *** thresholds  and safe words 

The gentleman in question said to me that he liked his sub to safe word or “tap out” in every single play session 

We had a wonderfully healthy debate about it 

I’m wondering what the views are across the community . 
Sx 

 

 

[Ni****]

Personally I've never had a submissive use her safe word, mainly because I start slow and build the amount of *** I inflict over time and meetings. This gives me time to learn their limits and how to read their body language and reactions, so as to stop or reduce impact once I've reached their limits. Works for me, and them 🙂

[Mz****]

I tend to be almost the completely opposite way, for me its almost like I've failed if they have to "tap out"..I love to push my sub, but part of my enjoyment comes from reading them so well I can push right to the limit but not past it, part of that for me is underlining trust, showing them that they are safe with me, of course sometimes they want to be pushed harder, and sometimes I enjoy indulging that..no two encounters are ever the same.

[Shenna]

That is a lovely debate Sammy. Nice to see this talked about xxx

[SammyB]

31 minutes ago, MyMaster said:

Personally I've never had a submissive use her safe word, mainly because I start slow and build the amount of *** I inflict over time and meetings. This gives me time to learn their limits and how to read their body language and reactions, so as to stop or reduce impact once I've reached their limits. Works for me, and them 🙂

Thats certainly the approach I’m used to 

thank you for thanking the time to reply 

Sx 

[SammyB]

28 minutes ago, MzJax said:

I tend to be almost the completely opposite way, for me its almost like I've failed if they have to "tap out"..I love to push my sub, but part of my enjoyment comes from reading them so well I can push right to the limit but not past it, part of that for me is underlining trust, showing them that they are safe with me, of course sometimes they want to be pushed harder, and sometimes I enjoy indulging that..no two encounters are ever the same.

I agree no two encounters are ever the same and it is each to their own and whatever works within their dynamic for them is important 

All my Dominants have had the same attitude about failing MsJax 

I have to say my own opinion was that 

having a sub use a safe word was like setting them up for failure every time 

thank you MsJax for sharing as ever you are insightful 

Sx 

 

[Go****]

Although still very new to this wonderful world, I have never had to use safe words or tapping as things have never gotten anywhere near a level I could not take and it should never get there imo as the D should be aware of your body language, look on your face and in your eyes and that always takes time to build up.

[dizzydeano69]

I would say if it was a 'punishment' then a safeword (tap out) shouldn't be used just to stop the ***.. a punishment is just that, a punishment and both something to be stopped because of you wanting it to end..
Me personally have been punished in the past and have never used it as it's something you are receiving from your Dom/Domme... if you have a top that is experienced and/or a long 'relationship' has been struck then they would be able to read your body language and the way you react to your punishment and alter accordingly..
Just my thoughts that's all

[Ni****]

My pleasure, and not saying the other approach is wrong, just not how I do it. In some ways I'd feel that I'd failed if my submissive had to use her safe word, and only  came close once with a too hard flog directly on a pierced nipple ! x

[Foxter]

It all depends on the submissive, do they enjoy playing in the kinks they know they like or do they really want to push the boundaries and press up against those limits. It's not uncommon for subs who are mainly into humiliating/ degrading and wanting to find that part where they have to stop. That is their rush for them.

[SammyB]

1 minute ago, MyMaster said:

My pleasure, and not saying the other approach is wrong, just not how I do it. In some ways I'd feel that I'd failed if my submissive had to use her safe word, and only  came close once with a too hard flog directly on a pierced nipple ! x

I totally agree 

As I said to MsJax each time their own and whatever works for the two people in the dynamic 

I just think it always great to have a open conversation and hear others views and opinions 

sx 

 

 

[SammyB]

1 minute ago, Foxter said:

It all depends on the submissive, do they enjoy playing in the kinks they know they like or do they really want to push the boundaries and press up against those limits. It's not uncommon for subs who are mainly into humiliating/ degrading and wanting to find that part where they have to stop. That is their rush for them.

I totally agree there are many subs who may enjoy that kinda of play 

thank you for sharing I appreciate it 

Sx 

 

[ey****]

whilst not the discussion at hand

Nope, if your sub uses a safe word you haven't failed.  You only fail if you ignore it  The reason for their use could have so many variables that no matter how well you know each other that, on that particular day, something might not work.  Stress or head space. Being caught funny.  The temperature of the room.  

-

But, playing to the point of safe word.  I think it depends on the context.  This does have a problem that a sub might not want to use a safe word, despite needing to, for *** play will be over.  This could be especially crucial if something isn't right early on.

There's also the context of the activity being done - someone trying not to tap out during breath play carries a risk of passing out or passing irreversible damage.

But, as I say - context.

I've done a couple of things with an intention of ending with the safeword.  Once, actually, the intention wasn't to end the scene but to change it - and it was a filmed trampling scene and I actually had gone quite a long time without needing to safeword, so she started kicking me with her heel to make me, so we could switch to the next part of the clip.

Another, was actually with the same person privately.  We'd been doing some electric play and so to finish we wanted to see how much I could take without tapping.  

-

So, I'm saying in drawing from my experiences.  I don't think this is necessarily bad, but it's certainly a 'context applies' scenario to make sure the sub doesn't either put themselves in danger, or suffers any form of psychological problems post play if they feel disappointed they stopped the scene either because they wanted to play or 'let their Dominant down' - so it comes with extra challenges to be managed.

[Jack-3146]

Same like you

[SammyB]

14 minutes ago, eyemblacksheep said:

whilst not the discussion at hand

Nope, if your sub uses a safe word you haven't failed.  You only fail if you ignore it  The reason for their use could have so many variables that no matter how well you know each other that, on that particular day, something might not work.  Stress or head space. Being caught funny.  The temperature of the room.  

-

But, playing to the point of safe word.  I think it depends on the context.  This does have a problem that a sub might not want to use a safe word, despite needing to, for *** play will be over.  This could be especially crucial if something isn't right early on.

There's also the context of the activity being done - someone trying not to tap out during breath play carries a risk of passing out or passing irreversible damage.

But, as I say - context.

I've done a couple of things with an intention of ending with the safeword.  Once, actually, the intention wasn't to end the scene but to change it - and it was a filmed trampling scene and I actually had gone quite a long time without needing to safeword, so she started kicking me with her heel to make me, so we could switch to the next part of the clip.

Another, was actually with the same person privately.  We'd been doing some electric play and so to finish we wanted to see how much I could take without tapping.  

-

So, I'm saying in drawing from my experiences.  I don't think this is necessarily bad, but it's certainly a 'context applies' scenario to make sure the sub doesn't either put themselves in danger, or suffers any form of psychological problems post play if they feel disappointed they stopped the scene either because they wanted to play or 'let their Dominant down' - so it comes with extra challenges to be managed.

As ever you bring a lot of wise words and balance 

thank you for taking the time to reply 

Sx 

[Wo****]

I've rarely had to use safewords. "Red" is stop everything and check in. Could be a stop or could be something like I need to change position. 

Using my Safe word isn't failing. It's communicating.

 

My thoughts on a Dominant who strives to get me to use it,  I'd pass. I'm with MzJax on this one. Push boundaries, sure, but I'd rather do that within an established dynamic where you understand how each  other tick.

[typhoon2]

As a Top or Dom I never play with a safeword. I play with safewords, at least two of them (and linked gestures and non-verbal cues for gagged play and similar circumstances). 'Red' is stop play immediately and free her, without hesitation or argument. It's never happened to me but I'm always prepared for it and they're thoroughly briefed, including egress from the play space, where the nearest safe space is (a shop with staff, the Dungeon Monitors, etc.), and similar safety details. 'Amber' is used for incidences when the scene should be paused, not halted. It might mean that cramp is setting in or a toy is less comfortable than intended, or perhaps they want to suggest a change. Lots of reasons to take a moment to sort things out and then back to the action. Of course I don't just rely on the bottom/sub to tell me if there's an issue - I'm constantly monitoring them for issues that they're unaware of or which they are unable to process for whatever reason (subspace, inexperience, etc.). Tapping out as an only alternative is far too inflexible in my view.

I'm happy to press boundaries, if they're in informed agreement and I feel it's safe to do so but would never set out to achieve it every single play session. Apart from being a bit routine it's likely to incur a competitive atmosphere which isn't healthy.

[SammyB]

21 minutes ago, Bounty said:

I've rarely had to use safewords. "Red" is stop everything and check in. Could be a stop or could be something like I need to change position. 

Using my Safe word isn't failing. It's communicating.

 

My thoughts on a Dominant who strives to get me to use it,  I'd pass. I'm with MzJax on this one. Push boundaries, sure, but I'd rather do that within an established dynamic where you understand how each  other tick.

I agree bounty
thank you for taking the time to respond 

Sx 

 

[SammyB]

11 minutes ago, typhoon2 said:

As a Top or Dom I never play with a safeword. I play with safewords, at least two of them (and linked gestures and non-verbal cues for gagged play and similar circumstances). 'Red' is stop play immediately and free her, without hesitation or argument. It's never happened to me but I'm always prepared for it and they're thoroughly briefed, including egress from the play space, where the nearest safe space is (a shop with staff, the Dungeon Monitors, etc.), and similar safety details. 'Amber' is used for incidences when the scene should be paused, not halted. It might mean that cramp is setting in or a toy is less comfortable than intended, or perhaps they want to suggest a change. Lots of reasons to take a moment to sort things out and then back to the action. Of course I don't just rely on the bottom/sub to tell me if there's an issue - I'm constantly monitoring them for issues that they're unaware of or which they are unable to process for whatever reason (subspace, inexperience, etc.). Tapping out as an only alternative is far too inflexible in my view.

I'm happy to press boundaries, if they're in informed agreement and I feel it's safe to do so but would never set out to achieve it every single play session. Apart from being a bit routine it's likely to incur a competitive atmosphere which isn't healthy.

I had this conversation recently where I have said often just because a sub mouth is asking or begging for something doesn’t mean they should receive because from the eyes of a Dominant her body may be saying enough 

thanks for sharing 

Sx 

[li****]

I've had to use safeword in a previous D/s relationship as he actually went past it to the point I screamed it and had to kick my way out of the situation because I knew he wasn't gonna stop, but I know he wasn't a Dom he was just an ***r!! I've never had to say my red safeword with Sir @Liam52 as he knows to build me up slowly then yes he'll get harder as the session goes on but he never ever pushes me to the point of saying my safeword! He knows the things I do like the little noises I make or just those slight movements he knows I'm at my limit. 

 

i can't speak for Sir on how he feels if he made me get to that point of saying my safeword, but I'm sure he doesn't want me to get there because of my past experience. But each to their own on their dynamics etc, but I think the only time I'd have to use them would be if I have to move in the session etc. I don't think it's failing like @Bounty says it's a way of communicating! 

Edited December 1, 2020 by lil-monster
Added more

[SammyB]

8 minutes ago, lil-monster said:

I've had to use safeword in a previous D/s relationship as he actually went past it to the point I screamed it and had to kick my way out of the situation because I knew he wasn't gonna stop, but I know he wasn't a Dom he was just an ***r!! I've never had to say my red safeword with Sir @Liam52 as he knows to build me up slowly then yes he'll get harder as the session goes on but he never ever pushes me to the point of saying my safeword! He knows the things I do like the little noises I make or just those slight movements he knows I'm at my limit. 

 

i can't speak for Sir on how he feels if he made me get to that point of saying my safeword, but I'm sure he doesn't want me to get there because of my past experience. But each to their own on their dynamics etc, but I think the only time I'd have to use them would be if I have to move in the session etc. I don't think it's failing like @Bounty says it's a way of communicating! 

Thanks for sharing your personal experience   

Sx 

[li****]

18 minutes ago, SammyB said:

Thanks for sharing your personal experience   

Sx 

You're welcome, it's a fantastic topic!!! 💜

[Deleted Member]

Personally I don’t want to make a sub use her safe word. I would feel that I had misjudged the session. I’ve been with Lilm long enough to read her body language pretty well, I know when she’s getting close to her limit and will ease off before building up the play again. I like to go close but not over and have safe words used. I also think that some subs feel a sense of shame and failure using safe words , something I absolutely disagree with and I will go to great lengths to get the message over that there is absolutely no shame in safe wording . They are there for a reason to keep both parties safe, but some still do see it as a failure on their part and will desperately try not to safe word even when it’s gone past the point where they want to stop. That’s why I personally wouldn’t want to get a sub to safe word, for me I would far rather know my subs reactions and body language, read the play, take it to the edge but recognise that edge and ease off. If I got that slightly wrong and they did safe word I would go to lengths to reassure them that they did exactly the right thing.

[SammyB]

25 minutes ago, Liam52 said:

Personally I don’t want to make a sub use her safe word. I would feel that I had misjudged the session. I’ve been with Lilm long enough to read her body language pretty well, I know when she’s getting close to her limit and will ease off before building up the play again. I like to go close but not over and have safe words used. I also think that some subs feel a sense of shame and failure using safe words , something I absolutely disagree with and I will go to great lengths to get the message over that there is absolutely no shame in safe wording . They are there for a reason to keep both parties safe, but some still do see it as a failure on their part and will desperately try not to safe word even when it’s gone past the point where they want to stop. That’s why I personally wouldn’t want to get a sub to safe word, for me I would far rather know my subs reactions and body language, read the play, take it to the edge but recognise that edge and ease off. If I got that slightly wrong and they did safe word I would go to lengths to reassure them that they did exactly the right thing.

Thanks Liam for sharing your thoughts and experiences it’s much appreciated 

Sx 

 

[LanceH]

I personally like to ride the line, not cross it. Especially if fairly new in a relationship it can cause issues. But it also depends on the nature of the relationship or scene.