Big difference in male and female subs

[ge****]

See, as I suspected it would, this has turned into a "pity poor me" fest from those amongst us who can't see beyond the end of their dick/ego and think they're hard done by - when actually everything lies in their power to both improve their experience and avoid falling prey to those seeking to part them from their m0ney.
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It's always someone else's fault and not their own too 🙄
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All I will say chaps is take a look closer to home for the source of the issue - it's all within your control to make things better for yourself, you can't expect others to fix it for you or offer what you seek without putting some effort in yourselves - update your profiles to make yourselves more appealing, have your guard up against scammers and don't engage with the "too good to be true" approaches you might get - learn how to watch for tell tale signs.
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I could go on, but frankly I've posted things like this many times and no-one seems to listen or want to help themselves, so I'd likely be wasting my breath!!

[UK****]

  16 hours ago, eyemblacksheep said:

Pound for pound - women are more likely to be victims of dating scams then men.   

 

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Can you expand on this?  Are they more likely to fall for scams or targetted in different ways to men?  Women to me seem far more sensible than most men so this surprises me.

[Au****]

  17 hours ago, CopperKnob said:

Am I susceptible to online scams? Of course, but no more than anyone else.
In the world of D/s or Fet, have I received messages asking for banking details with regards to sugar daddies? Of course, many times.
Have I fallen for m0ney based scams? Fortunately not. Likely, due to sensibility and a lack of desperation.
If this is something that is a 'constant', I would suggest that the issue lies with the individual who keeps coming face to face with the issue.
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The point is that men are worrying about a loss of funds that are replaceable either through the Bank if you report or through future earnings. Women, on the other hand, are worried about physical or emotional h@rm. The two are not equitable.

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I agree with you but the point here all the whole thread is “difference in male and female subs”.
Charging someone who you don’t know for an encounter or scamming someone won’t solve any woman safety problem, maybe it even will worsen it creating more frustration among men who experiment that.
Everyone, every gender have have their own complaint and issues..
Also, even man can get harmed by meeting someone wrong, me myself very recently felt unsafe going to meet a girl in her own house and I didn’t go..
It’s less frequent off course for obvious reasons but it happens, man suffer *** too..

[ey****]

  49 minutes ago, UK_Knight said:

Can you expand on this?  Are they more likely to fall for scams or targetted in different ways to men?  Women to me seem far more sensible than most men so this surprises me.

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Women are targeted differently.  

So the ones that target women are usually slow burner.  Men tend to be targeted quickly for relatively low amounts - not that some would argue 100-500 is low, but the common sub scams are "yes, I'll be your Mistress and all you have to do is this thing with a one off payment" (book a dungeon, buy a training kit, get an expensive membership, etc.) 

There are a couple of quick-wins that target women which are usually sugar daddy scams, particularly when it will appear that they have sent *** that they actually haven't, or can recall.    This could be to get something from the lady, or it can often be "Hey, so I sent you (say) £2000 and it's left me short, can you send me just £200 back" - which sounds fine except the £2k was never sent or can be recalled.

The ones that tend to target women mind are usually slow burners where they will spend a lot of time on the mark and there'll be some huge problem either when it comes time to meet, or to meet again if a meeting has taken place.  The Tindr Swindler on Netflix is a good example watch, it's a variation on some of the common scams that target women. 

[Au****]

  18 hours ago, eyemblacksheep said:

oh mate

- Women get threats of physical or sexual *** - people sending them dick pics, inappropriate erotica, fantasy pushing - so on

- Men are like, oh it's so hard as people ask for ***

get a grip 

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I don’t see why man issues should be less than woman issue.
I know this is a trend right know and that’s why I’m here supporting what I know and what I feel.
I talk from a privileged position but that doesn’t mean that I didn’t pass trough all this that have been said and felt enough to be here giving my opinion.

I’m in open relations since years I know very well what woman pass through and I support their issues and safety concerns by taking actions too.

Every gender has its own problem equally respectable, equally worthy to be dealt with in a proper way.

But here are in this thread a man expressed his very rightful concern/ frustration, very fair to be listened and helped, as I man knowing what he passes trough I give my support and opinion, you as a man shouldn’t you do the same? I don’t get it..
Cheers

[ey****]

  13 hours ago, gemini_man said:

See, as I suspected it would, this has turned into a "pity poor me" fest from those amongst us who can't see beyond the end of their dick/ego and think they're hard done by - when actually everything lies in their power to both improve their experience and avoid falling prey to those seeking to part them from their m0ney.
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It's always someone else's fault and not their own too 🙄

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This is the problem.   See, I come naively expecting a thought out diatribe between the differences between M/f and F/m - and instead it's the old £$£ arguments and lazy-ass "women have it easier"

A lot of which is rooted in their own misogyny which is then a tell on why they can't find a Dominant Woman. 

Like, I rarely get people asking for payment.  I think cold contact it's been something like 2 in the past 3 months and of course I rarely reach out to others - but so far my "sure only if £££" response has been 0 (and from memory I think I get around 75% replies - regardless on where they ultimately go)

The kinda assumption is that it's easier for women would suggest that men have lower quality control or standards on who they would accept. In itself, that is a self own.

A next assumption is that it's easier for women to pick since they get hundreds of messages.  Some of which neglects to accept that she doesn't *have* to pick and rather than a rivalry with each other they are a rivalry to her solitude -- but also rather how men fantasise they would respond if they got a lot of messages.  Being blissfully unaware of how draining carrying conversations can be -- but also that they themselves would be likely to play people against each other (whilst also complaining if women set any standards) 

Ironically, most of the messages I get are from men who either (a) cannot read profiles (b) want me to introduce them to someone (sorry, you haven't even introduced yourself to me?!) or (c) want to call me names for something I wrote  

Finding a partner is, ultimately, difficult for everyone.  Though solely looking by filtering on a website is never going to end well. 

[Th****]

It’s because they’re scammers they don’t want a bond and the ones that do are few are far between… basically legal sex workers

[ey****]

  2 hours ago, Charlie218 said:

I don’t see why man issues should be less than woman issue.
I know this is a trend right know and that’s why I’m here supporting what I know and what I feel.
I talk from a privileged position but that doesn’t mean that I didn’t pass trough all this that have been said and felt enough to be here giving my opinion.

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I wouldn't say "less than" but the issues are different

If as a man you decide to send someone *** (of your own free will) if it doesn't go as you desire then at worst you're slightly out of pocket, maybe feeling like your time was wasted.   Like, I dunno, going to a gig which was disappointing or a restaurant that wasn't worth it.

If you are actually scammed then again, at the worst you're out of pocket, maybe feeling a little humiliated - but if you take this to your bank then providing you didn't do something totally stupid like give someone untraceable gift cards then you can get the *** back.

It is of course possible to be on the receiving end of some form of harm, be it dangerous play, or ***, etc - but this is not something male subs tend to ever even bring up.   I would say a big difference between subs here is that if a man ended up in hospital due to dangerous play during, say, ballbusting - it'd be "haha shouldn't have let her kick you in the balls" whereas there might be a little more sympathy if a woman is injured through dangerous play (apart from some who would say she should vet more) 

But this is it; if a female sub is on the receiving end of physical or sexual *** then this can't be undone, it's not something you can feel a bit silly about call a bank and it be undone.   

  2 hours ago, Charlie218 said:

But here are in this thread a man expressed his very rightful concern/ frustration, very fair to be listened and helped, as I man knowing what he passes trough I give my support and opinion, you as a man shouldn’t you do the same? I don’t get it..
Cheers

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I guess, 'as a man' - maybe there is bits I could, or should, empathise with - but the majority of the issue comes from male behaviour

There's stuff where... I don't wish to sound cold, so I guess.

Yes - it sucks you get a message from someone and you look and they then start asking for *** (even if it was probably obvious from the profile.   even if it does also suck if you're a lady and it's another guy sending you a low effort message, or a shopping list)

but it is the nature of dating that you will get some messages where the other person is not what you are looking for. Such is life.

I could also agree of course that it might suck if you struggle to get replies from your messages and then you do see the icon, it's a reply... and a demand for ***.   But again, in a lot of cases this should be obvious from the profile, either cos it says or implies, or because it's a low effort profile (I don't get why guys would ever message a low effort profile, it says more about their lack of standards)

The big problem I know that happens is that guys message lots of women, 'genuine' women see this and find this off putting, but sellers will always reply.  You messaged them, they think you're buying.

When we say above about men's and women's issues - it's important here for men, ultimately, to stop assuming women have it easy - they don't, they have it different.

There isn't the shortage of Dominant, or potentially Dominant, women that men like to think they have (it appeases to the fact they haven't found anyone - it CAN'T be them at fault it MUST be a shortage!) however for whatever reason, aside from the fact dating is hard (especially online) they've done little to showcase to the other person why they are a good match or worth a conversation with.

The next kinda thing is not to put all the eggs into the online basket.  When someone is like "Oh, all women want $$$" the alarm this sets off is how little the guys actually know about kink or engage in kink beyond look at online websites - want to meet women who are Dominant and open about it? Go to kink events.  Meet with them and learn from them.

And if events isn't for you... then, y'know, in general more women would be into Femdom etc if it *actually* benefited them and not just about satisfying guys wishlist of kink.    There's scope for learning there.   While, also, a lot of women are into at least trying kink, but again, it has to be something which isn't more work for them.   

More women are interested in men who bring them value.  And if you don't show how you are valuable and value them, then you will only ever get those who talk in green. 

 

[CopperKnob]

  7 hours ago, Charlie218 said:

I agree with you but the point here all the whole thread is “difference in male and female subs”.
Charging someone who you don’t know for an encounter or scamming someone won’t solve any woman safety problem, maybe it even will worsen it creating more frustration among men who experiment that.
Everyone, every gender have have their own complaint and issues..
Also, even man can get harmed by meeting someone wrong, me myself very recently felt unsafe going to meet a girl in her own house and I didn’t go..
It’s less frequent off course for obvious reasons but it happens, man suffer *** too..

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I think, and to build on Eyem's comment re differences, if a man posts about something awful happening, they don't experience women commenting that it didn't happen, they aren't challenged about their vetting process or lack of.
They aren't asked why they were drinking or asked what they were wearing etc etc. No one here has negated anyone else's experiences. No one here has victim blamed, which is what happens consistently and persistently with female subs.
.
And to move on to your other comment, women aren't saying men's issues/rights are less than women's. What they're saying is, this is our experience, this has been happening for centuries, we (and other minority genders) want and deserve equity in all area's of life. It's not a 'trend' is something that's been championed for decades.
Men wouldn't feel so threatened by feminism if there manhood was rooted in something other than oppressing women.
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The other point I'll make is this because it's always the same gripe, in relation to there being so few Dommes, what do you think happens in society to women that stand up for themselves? We're seeing how that plays out in both England and Ireland right now.
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Lastly, shall we look up the stats re *** being perpetrated by gender? Because whilst I agree with you that male subs can experience harm, it's very few and far between. We could also look up which gender is more likely to be the source of risk to males generally is if you'd like?

[Deleted Member]

I have seen quite a number of younger women on here, claiming that they're "dommes" and references to themselves as "findom" types on their profiles, and all they're really interested in is someone to bail them out of their financial debts. I find that genuine dommes tend to be older and financially stable. I'm always wary of anyone under the age of 40, claiming that they're a domme. I would never pay anyone to be my domme, I would only be interested if they were genuinely attracted to me and I was attracted to them and we mutually and genuinely liked everything about eachother. 

 

[Alpalmson]

  On 11/29/2024 at 1:54 PM, zzbeard said:

Why are male subs treated way different than female subs? Male submission is more about $$ than real true submission. Females are submissive but are never asked for $$???

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The difference is the type of doms in control.  For female subs, it is just a natural relationship where no tribute is ever expected.  Usually, these relationships are between husband/wife, BF/GF, and  friends with benefits.  For male subs, it is different. Yes, there are the usual relationships between those already partnered.  As for males who can't find a dom, they are left looking for Dommes who are for the most part Pro-Dommes.  They expect a tribute of some type-- usually monetary or gifts of some type.  Also, the Pro-Dommes are very likely NOT to provided sexual services.  Yes, it is a double standard.  This is why there are boards like this where guys (if lucky enough) can find a dom who isn't in it for the *** and will actually perform sexual activities.

[ge****]

  7 hours ago, Alpalmson said:

The difference is the type of doms in control.  For female subs, it is just a natural relationship where no tribute is ever expected.  Usually, these relationships are between husband/wife, BF/GF, and  friends with benefits.  For male subs, it is different. Yes, there are the usual relationships between those already partnered.  As for males who can't find a dom, they are left looking for Dommes who are for the most part Pro-Dommes.  They expect a tribute of some type-- usually monetary or gifts of some type.  Also, the Pro-Dommes are very likely NOT to provided sexual services.  Yes, it is a double standard.  This is why there are boards like this where guys (if lucky enough) can find a dom who isn't in it for the *** and will actually perform sexual activities.

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Totally disagree with the point that male subs are mostly left with Pro Dommes to look for - I've never looked for a Pro Domme in my life, and never have any intention of doing so (not because I have an issue with Pro Dommes and the services they provide, just that for me it would be too clinical and transactional) - I have however had plenty of wonderful experiences with dominant women who don't expect any kind of payment.
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It comes down to being respectful, considerate, showing that you know and understand your submission and aren't just looking at women as kink dispensers to satisfy *your* needs and a lot more besides - sadly something that many men overlook in their desperation to find a Domme, any Domme.

[ey****]

  8 hours ago, Alpalmson said:

For male subs, it is different. Yes, there are the usual relationships between those already partnered.  As for males who can't find a dom, they are left looking for Dommes who are for the most part Pro-Dommes.  They expect a tribute of some type-- usually monetary or gifts of some type.  Also, the Pro-Dommes are very likely NOT to provided sexual services.  Yes, it is a double standard

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There's stuff which you kinda sum up on another thread which is... a lot of male subs generally seek out "the finished product" they want someone experienced, who maybe already has the clothes and toys, who can pander to subs fantasies and so on so forth.

So yep - Pro-Dommes already have this - and are willing to give a fantasy in exchange for tribute.

And of course, those who are already partnered.  But if you ever like... I dunno... talk... to folk who are partnered you'll find that this is something they built up over a period of time.  That there's been trial and error - and that, ahem, sometimes how things appear in public and online are more relaxed when they lock their door at night.

Female subs are, on one hand - often a little bit more forgiving of this.  But on another - there are plenty of Male Dominants who would put themselves forward who really don't have much/any experience - because it's often about what they would get out of it. 

By irony - male subs tend to seek experienced Dommes, whilst not themselves being experienced submissives.  Now THAT is double standards.

[Th****]

  2 hours ago, eyemblacksheep said:

By irony - male subs tend to seek experienced Dommes, whilst not themselves being experienced submissives.  Now THAT is double standards.

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I find it extremely ironic that every "male sub" that has ever talked to me refused to give up any type of control. He only wanted to do what he wanted to do and didn't care about anything that I told him.

If female sub ever did that, she would be labeled as a horrible sub. 

But "male subs" think that that's okay. Make it make sense.

 

(I also wish that they would actually call themselves a bottom and not a sub. It makes actual subs looks bad.)

[ey****]

  48 minutes ago, TheMacabreBrat said:

I find it extremely ironic that every "male sub" that has ever talked to me refused to give up any type of control. He only wanted to do what he wanted to do and didn't care about anything that I told him.

 

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This to a degree is sometimes why I feel uncomfortable using sub to describe myself.  Although how I might generally be towards someone could be a big part of whether we're engaging in play or what more is there in the concept of any relationship.  

But yes, I've heard this before from Dommes, too many times. 

I know one of the first stories I got, ooh, going on for 13 years ago. Guy had been asking a lady he sometimes played with at clubs about being a live in sub.  She agreed.  They agreed a start date and had discussed expectations and she spent time clearing out a spare room (the old 'sleep in a cage on the stairs' trope isn't practical - especially as the guy needs to be in good condition to go out and do a day job) and he moved in.

Five days.

That's how long before he called it off.  

They both had to work day jobs and the kinda expectancy was he, as a live in sub, would be making her life easier - taking on more of a share of cooking, cleaning, housework, etc. doing little things to make things better. And she had said things would take time.  He'd mess up a task and want punished.  Err, no. The task STILL needs done and NOW there needs to be time/energy spared to punish you?  The idea of you doing the tasks was to free up time/energy so we could play.

He'd be disappointed she didn't look like she did in the club.  Well, no - that takes however long to get ready, which for a night out - yes... for coming home after day job, err. No. 

And just a stack up like that.  When asked about housework he was very "I'm not that type of sub" - that basically in his head, despite common sense and comms - he'd assumed it'd be play every or most days.  So cos he didn't get his own way, he didn't try to make it work - just called it off after five days. 

 

[Th****]

  7 hours ago, TheMacabreBrat said:

I find it extremely ironic that every "male sub" that has ever talked to me refused to give up any type of control. He only wanted to do what he wanted to do and didn't care about anything that I told him.

If female sub ever did that, she would be labeled as a horrible sub. 

But "male subs" think that that's okay. Make it make sense.

 

(I also wish that they would actually call themselves a bottom and not a sub. It makes actual subs looks bad.)

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This. Most men who claim to be submissives, in fact aren't. They haven't a clue what it actually entails and are generally resistant to doing any sort of research and education on their own. They expect to be spoon fed everything "teach me, train me." Why? Why would any woman want to? What's in it for them? Usually, not enough to make the idea appealing. 

Edited April 6 by ThaliaV

[ey****]

  9 minutes ago, ThaliaV said:

They expect to be spoon fed everything "teach me, train me." Why? Why would any woman want to? What's in it for them? Usually, not enough to make the idea appealing. 

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This was something I referenced on another thread - the whole micromanaging and emotional labour

but also... if their source of learning is one person, how do they know what they're being told is right?  

[Th****]

  40 minutes ago, eyemblacksheep said:

This was something I referenced on another thread - the whole micromanaging and emotional labour

but also... if their source of learning is one person, how do they know what they're being told is right?  

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It's a topic that comes up often because it's such a prolific issue. 

That's another problem, they don't bother to figure those things out. That's also how they end up thinking femdom 🌽 is realistic and it's really really not and they often have a tantrum when they're told as much. 

[ey****]

  52 minutes ago, ThaliaV said:

It's a topic that comes up often because it's such a prolific issue. 

That's another problem, they don't bother to figure those things out.

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and, it coming up so much is often a flag that no one has even looked to see if it's been asked before. 

[Th****]

  2 hours ago, eyemblacksheep said:

and, it coming up so much is often a flag that no one has even looked to see if it's been asked before. 

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You mean put forth effort!? 😱

[ey****]

  7 hours ago, ThaliaV said:

You mean put forth effort!? 😱

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I tell this story now and then, but when I first joined a fetish site (y'know, the other one) I spent most of the first three months just reading posts and improving knowledge.   I did my "Hi, I'm new" post to coincide with going to a first munch (where between that and a workshop I learnt more in an afternoon than in 3 months online; not that the online time wasn't valuable) and, I dunno. It's done me OK.

Mind, in this time one of the things I did was spending a lot of times seeing things which clearly weren't working and spending time going "OK, so that approach doesn't work" even if, 13 years later, I still see guys trying/failing the same way. 

[ge****]

  3 hours ago, eyemblacksheep said:

I tell this story now and then, but when I first joined a fetish site (y'know, the other one) I spent most of the first three months just reading posts and improving knowledge.   I did my "Hi, I'm new" post to coincide with going to a first munch (where between that and a workshop I learnt more in an afternoon than in 3 months online; not that the online time wasn't valuable) and, I dunno. It's done me OK.

Mind, in this time one of the things I did was spending a lot of times seeing things which clearly weren't working and spending time going "OK, so that approach doesn't work" even if, 13 years later, I still see guys trying/failing the same way. 

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I think one of the biggest problems across sites like this is that the vast majority of men (whether they be sub, dom, swingers or whatever else) think it's a simple way to easy sex/kink - don't educate themselves and worse still don't listen when advise is given.
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I've lost count of the times I've stumbled across a "What can I do to improve my chances?" type thread and have given advice that has worked for me, and that I know works for others and invariably either get argued with by the person asking for the advice, or the advice is roundly ignored.

[ey****]

  6 hours ago, gemini_man said:

I think one of the biggest problems across sites like this is that the vast majority of men (whether they be sub, dom, swingers or whatever else) think it's a simple way to easy sex/kink - don't educate themselves and worse still don't listen when advise is given.
.

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Yep - that's pretty much it the collation between 'kink' and 'easy' and we see it all the time.  

Perhaps some haven't got time to research, because they're cheating and just have an hour online when their wife has gone to bed.

Perhaps some would have time, but they just come out of a relationship and what to get 'freeky' goddamnit 

or, for some of the young uns who somehow feel this is their best chance of losing their virginity 

and it's like arrgghhhhh stahhhhhp 

 

Granted, of course - if a female sub was in any of the above positions they would be harvested by men, but that says more about the men that it does them. 

[Alpalmson]

  On 4/6/2025 at 6:21 PM, ThaliaV said:

You mean put forth effort!? 😱

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  16 hours ago, gemini_man said:

I think one of the biggest problems across sites like this is that the vast majority of men (whether they be sub, dom, swingers or whatever else) think it's a simple way to easy sex/kink - don't educate themselves and worse still don't listen when advise is given.
.
I've lost count of the times I've stumbled across a "What can I do to improve my chances?" type thread and have given advice that has worked for me, and that I know works for others and invariably either get argued with by the person asking for the advice, or the advice is roundly ignored.

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I will defer to the Wayne Gretzky school of thought. "You miss 100% of the shots you don't take."

I do my research and due diligence.  I've tried to learn from other's advice as well as my own failures.  I was "one of those types" when I first began exploring, but over the past decade or so, success has been gradual.  I think it takes the mentality of sometimes you need to know what you don't know.

I will say this though.  Just like real estate, it is all about location, location, location.  I live in an area that barely has a heart beat of a scene.

[ey****]

  6 hours ago, Alpalmson said:

I will defer to the Wayne Gretzky school of thought. "You miss 100% of the shots you don't take."

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I think there's something you cover in further points, so I mean this in a wider sense than specific

The thing with Gretzky is he didn't just turn up one day - without any clue what he was doing - and started hitting shots and racking up the points.   Otherwise everyone would do the same.   Gretzky didn't take too many high risks, because he didn't need to - he was good with precision, timing and efficency.

And so as I say, he didn't just turn up one day.  He learnt the rules, he studied the game, he trained and continued to work and train - he also had another famous quote, "When you win say nothing, when you lose say less" which was again referencing not to be sore loser, or complain about losing, but continuing to work on bettering yourself and bettering your game.

This is kinda the problem with a lot of sub guys they turn up and hit shots and are relying on flukes - when they haven't done any of the other things.  Then when they don't get what they want, blame others or 'the game' rather than continuing to better themselves.

  6 hours ago, Alpalmson said:

I will say this though.  Just like real estate, it is all about location, location, location.  I live in an area that barely has a heart beat of a scene.

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This is a big thing which can change a landscape, but honestly in the UK we have people who live in/near London or around Birmingham which have huge scenes and they find something else to complain about   But yeah I've seen people who live in remote areas and it's 2 hour drive to the nearest munch, or 4 hours to the nearest play event.   As well as those who live in big areas but it just doesn't connect with what they want.

So this then becomes something to factor in.

There are also people who have relocated to be closer to a scene more their vibe