Tell me if I am wrong.

[Deleted Member]

5 hours ago, MisstressStorm said:

Your experience unfortunately is the norm now. Whilst there is nothing inherently wrong , I feel in being paid for a service. Would you expect not to pay for a delicious meal that someone has cooked for you ?
I am tired of toxic men expecting me to be a free Kink dispenser just because they say “ Yes Mistress “ ( Doms are particularly guilty of this ).
I come across faux mistresses frequently and call them out/ report them . This prompted me to form a group
Ethical Dommes and male subs where the subs can have contact with Dominas who don’t want financial renumeration.
If I spend time and energy with a sub , if he wants to give a gift , flowers , chocolate, lingerie, that sits well with me. Or if he wants to buy underwear of mine then that’s ok too - Kink wear isn’t cheap.
Does that make me a FinDom , I don’t think so.
I agree that if *** is the basis of the dynamic that slants the dynamic and not in a positive way. How can you freely Domme if someone is paying for Their needs to be fulfilled. They will call the tune and dictate the session. I’d rather Kink for free on my own terms and within the subs hard limits. My reward is the beauty of the sub surrendering , willingly ,on the alter of Storm .
Mistress Storm ⛈️

Mistress it is very hard for truly submissive men out in the world because of the personality trait that makes us want to please a mistress at all times And makes us *** to be ***d. I totally agree that when in a relationship with a dominant it is the submissiveness place to support with the cost of kink and clothing etc especially anything personal to the submissive, toys,clothing etc. also a submissive wants to let mistress know she is appreciated for the special connection and unique way he is treated by buying her gifts of clothing makeup flowers, taking her for meals, and help pay for furniture to develop their play room after all it is for both parties , all this develops over time and is of mutual benefit for mistress and sub. It’s very refreshing to read your comments and I would like to learn more about your group Ethical Dommes

[Deleted Member]

1 hour ago, EMandM said:

Not many men read them anyway.

That’s both sad and frustrating. I’m sorry you experience this kind of entitlement.

[ey****]

1 hour ago, rich-62 said:

Mistress it is very hard for truly submissive men out in the world because of the personality trait that makes us want to please a mistress at all times And makes us *** to be ***d.

I think submissives, in general, can often be *** especially if they get a bit wrapped up in sub frenzy.

and even aside from prospective bad actors, can often say or do things in a bid to impress which either they can't follow through on or gets them into a situation they're not happy with despite their prior consent (and while consent CAN be withdrawn at any time, some often feel they'll be branded a fake or a timewaster should they do so)

one important thing to always kind of ask yourselves is - why exactly do I want to impress *this person* and if you don't really know them from shit, there's no reason to push yourself outside of what is comfortable

it's important to ground yourself, not to get carried away and be able to appreciate rationally.  Because even the most "genuine" of Dominant is going to have problems if they find you'd been doing things in attempt to try to impress them rather than it being mutually enjoyable. They'll then never know when you are genuinely unhappy or not.

It's ok to say "no, that's not for me" 

[Deleted Member]

1 hour ago, eyemblacksheep said:

having 'paypigs' and 'tribute' as a hard limit isn't really going to change anything in the sense that, as you say, these are not people who are reading profiles - but, also, that whether it's a scammer or not they're not permitted to ask for paid play in this way.

 

What I have found, is a lot of women find it off-putting when guys make a big deal of "no findom, no tribute, etc" on their profiles.  Because whether we like it, or not, there is a lot of finances involved in all relationships, especially D/s ones.   

What I mean by this in general

Go on a date to a restaurant.  There's 3 possible ways to split the bill.  (1) one person pays for it all. (2) an agreed split, say, 50/50 of the total.  (3) everyone pays exclusively for what they had. 
no one likes (3) it's clunky and awkward.    So usually it's (1) or (2) and the other person has to feel comfortable to order what they would like even if they get a started, an extra drink or more expensive main - and it's inevitable one person will pay for more than they had.  And especially if one person decides further dates are required, or, actually, let's not meet again - they shouldn't feel like they "owe" the other person because they paid more - or be uncomfortable and order less.      And I remember a friend went on a date with a guy who was anti tribute, anti findom, etc. and she kinda felt "is he going to think this of me if I order what I'd like" and so ended up having a less than enjoyable night.

Aside from even the concept of dating - let's say you've had a few dates and are in a relationship.  If things you've discussed involves certain toys, outfits, equipment, etc.  then the kind of... who pays for it?   If you really like seeing your partner in (say) latex but she can't presently afford new latex - do you do without until she can afford it, pay for it and get her to repay you (in part or full), or buy it as something you can both enjoy - whatever the option, it show cases the importance of *** in here.

And so again, a lot of ladies sometimes feel that when men push away from ***, even if it might be contextually different if you're in a relationship, that a lot is going to fall on them.


That, and of course, many women have a friend who works professionally to some degree and their friendship is more important than a "sub" guy who hates them.

For me, there is a difference between being a decent person and tributes. Dates do not fall under tributes, meals don’t fall under tributes, that is just good dating etiquette. If someone doesn’t want to interact with me on here because I have no tributes listed as a hard limit, that’s a them issue, nothing to do with me. If I’m dating someone, I will insist on paying for meals, going away on the weekend, etc. but that is very far from being asked for something before you have even met. You may disagree, but my filter works like a charm (for me). But I reiterate, this app, and apps like it do not lead to anything with substance. This, for me, is a place to learn and experience second hand, so I don’t fall into traps I would otherwise not see. Munches and events are the only way, as far as I see it, to connect on a human level.

[ey****]

Just now, h2ohno said:

Dates do not fall under tributes, meals don’t fall under tributes, that is just good dating etiquette

I think it's an interesting element - because - really, if you're paying for someone's meal, drinks, cinema entry, whatever as part of a date - then you are effectively paying someone for their time and company.  It may very well lead to something, but for example 33% of first dates don't lead to even a second date.

Obviously a lot of people still will accept this and absolutely - I would gladly go on a date with someone who interested me despite there being no certainties she would see me again.

But paying for someone's time and company in the hope you can make a good impression on them (and a hope they can make a good impression on you!) isn't really all that different from the whole concept of any form of tribute.    And a lot of the ideas for why men typically pay for dates is rooted from the same kinda logic.   

The men paying from dates in a bid to impress a partner is usually a means for them to show their generosity and financially capability of supporting the relationship.

[Deleted Member]

8 minutes ago, eyemblacksheep said:

I think it's an interesting element - because - really, if you're paying for someone's meal, drinks, cinema entry, whatever as part of a date - then you are effectively paying someone for their time and company.  It may very well lead to something, but for example 33% of first dates don't lead to even a second date.

Obviously a lot of people still will accept this and absolutely - I would gladly go on a date with someone who interested me despite there being no certainties she would see me again.

But paying for someone's time and company in the hope you can make a good impression on them (and a hope they can make a good impression on you!) isn't really all that different from the whole concept of any form of tribute.    And a lot of the ideas for why men typically pay for dates is rooted from the same kinda logic.   

The men paying from dates in a bid to impress a partner is usually a means for them to show their generosity and financially capability of supporting the relationship.

That’s a very interesting point. I can certainly see the connection. I’ve also been on dates with women who insist on paying too, because some men feel like they’re “owed something” if they pay. It makes sense that these elements would overlap. Maybe I’ll add a disclaimer to my hard limit to be more specific—thank you!

[ge****]

Another interesting point to consider - I very very rarely, in fact if at all, get approached by profiles looking for payment or tribute - there have been a couple of approaches that I suspect may have headed that way, which I've quickly shut down the conversation.
.
Yet to listen to some men on here it's a regular occurrence, I wonder what the difference is that I don't receive them - it can't be that I'm considered unworthy of such approaches (and I don't have any kind of written limit on my profile to ward them off), I don't have any filters deployed - so it makes me wonder if either the prevalence of such approaches isn't as great as some would suggest, or if there's something else that deflects them, or is it simply that I have my wits about me and cut them off before they get to the point of asking for payment? 🤔

[Deleted Member]

3 minutes ago, gemini_man said:

Another interesting point to consider - I very very rarely, in fact if at all, get approached by profiles looking for payment or tribute - there have been a couple of approaches that I suspect may have headed that way, which I've quickly shut down the conversation.
.
Yet to listen to some men on here it's a regular occurrence, I wonder what the difference is that I don't receive them - it can't be that I'm considered unworthy of such approaches (and I don't have any kind of written limit on my profile to ward them off), I don't have any filters deployed - so it makes me wonder if either the prevalence of such approaches isn't as great as some would suggest, or if there's something else that deflects them, or is it simply that I have my wits about me and cut them off before they get to the point of asking for payment? 🤔

That is interesting. I’ve also noticed that a lot of 1-2 day old profiles have a LOT of people messaging them—a mistake I made when I joined this site. If they’re only a few days old, I steer very clear. I’d say it is your experience that is the decisive factor here.

[Ar****]

32 minutes ago, gemini_man said:

Another interesting point to consider - I very very rarely, in fact if at all, get approached by profiles looking for payment or tribute - there have been a couple of approaches that I suspect may have headed that way, which I've quickly shut down the conversation.
.
Yet to listen to some men on here it's a regular occurrence, I wonder what the difference is that I don't receive them - it can't be that I'm considered unworthy of such approaches (and I don't have any kind of written limit on my profile to ward them off), I don't have any filters deployed - so it makes me wonder if either the prevalence of such approaches isn't as great as some would suggest, or if there's something else that deflects them, or is it simply that I have my wits about me and cut them off before they get to the point of asking for payment? 🤔

Seconded. I've no filters - anybody can message me - and neither you nor I are exactly hard to find 😂

Yet the most suspicious behaviour I ever seem to get from what I'd view as a would-be scammer is a random spank every few weeks from people living thousands of miles away 🤦‍♂️

[ca****]

I have noticed a huge increase in fakes, pay for play or just OF advertising within a kink context to grab attention and subscribers. The only thing we can all do as a community is keep reporting any profile that doesn't look right and for this site/app to up its game and ban people faster and for good.
We can all be part of the solution instead of just pointing out the problems

[ge****]

41 minutes ago, h2ohno said:

That is interesting. I’ve also noticed that a lot of 1-2 day old profiles have a LOT of people messaging them—a mistake I made when I joined this site. If they’re only a few days old, I steer very clear. I’d say it is your experience that is the decisive factor here.

But even when I was relatively new to the site I didn't get any - and would be scammers don't know my level of experience so suspect it my be a combination of all the factors I mentioned, coupled with the fact I put effort into my profile (whereas a lot of those bemoaning the scammers/tribute hunters don't) so perhaps that comes into play too

[ey****]

1 hour ago, gemini_man said:

Another interesting point to consider - I very very rarely, in fact if at all, get approached by profiles looking for payment or tribute

me neither.

what I have put it down to a little... 

1) I rarely reach out to message someone.  I think in the past year I actually contacted someone on a total of 3 occasions, and two of those ended in at least a conversation.  A 66% success rate!  But I am careful, and patient, and never message for the sake of it.  There's probably been far more people who maybe I should have messaged but didn't over the time but maybe felt I wasn't what they were looking for or some such (or perhaps they messaged me and I assumed it "to be nice" and I didn't find it appropriate to hit on them)

2) I don't use the app - in essence this means that I only see if I have messages if I log on.  Sometimes, I will log on and find I've had messages from someone who has already had their profile removed, so I've not really got into any form of deep conversation with them

3) I do reply to messages I think are interested, might be genuine, or even a "hey, I really liked what you wrote" (and even some of the ones which call me names... though if it gets no better I tend to block and report sooner rather than later) but if it's getting into the scammers playbook I usually just save my energy.

 

[ge****]

42 minutes ago, eyemblacksheep said:

me neither.

what I have put it down to a little... 

1) I rarely reach out to message someone.  I think in the past year I actually contacted someone on a total of 3 occasions, and two of those ended in at least a conversation.  A 66% success rate!  But I am careful, and patient, and never message for the sake of it.  There's probably been far more people who maybe I should have messaged but didn't over the time but maybe felt I wasn't what they were looking for or some such (or perhaps they messaged me and I assumed it "to be nice" and I didn't find it appropriate to hit on them)

2) I don't use the app - in essence this means that I only see if I have messages if I log on.  Sometimes, I will log on and find I've had messages from someone who has already had their profile removed, so I've not really got into any form of deep conversation with them

3) I do reply to messages I think are interested, might be genuine, or even a "hey, I really liked what you wrote" (and even some of the ones which call me names... though if it gets no better I tend to block and report sooner rather than later) but if it's getting into the scammers playbook I usually just save my energy.

 

Actually your first point is a good one - I'm the same, rarely if ever send a message to anyone outside of the forum users - so wonder perhaps if those getting "inundated" with scammers and people asking for tributes/*** are actually making the first move rather than the other way round, as I initially thought

[ey****]

26 minutes ago, gemini_man said:

Actually your first point is a good one - I'm the same, rarely if ever send a message to anyone outside of the forum users - so wonder perhaps if those getting "inundated" with scammers and people asking for tributes/*** are actually making the first move rather than the other way round, as I initially thought

I think first move can be either way round.  But if, say, someone doesn't have much prompt to be messaged - then it may well be that even if they get 2 messages and they're both scams, then 100% of messages are a scam that they have received

I also half wonder if placing a dating ad might be something scammers harvest.  Mulls... I might place an ad and see if that makes a difference

 

[Deleted Member]

4 hours ago, gemini_man said:

Another interesting point to consider - I very very rarely, in fact if at all, get approached by profiles looking for payment or tribute - there have been a couple of approaches that I suspect may have headed that way, which I've quickly shut down the conversation.
.
Yet to listen to some men on here it's a regular occurrence, I wonder what the difference is that I don't receive them - it can't be that I'm considered unworthy of such approaches (and I don't have any kind of written limit on my profile to ward them off), I don't have any filters deployed - so it makes me wonder if either the prevalence of such approaches isn't as great as some would suggest, or if there's something else that deflects them, or is it simply that I have my wits about me and cut them off before they get to the point of asking for payment? 🤔

Your profile isn't really one a scammer or someone just wanting tributes would target, you show intelligence, knowledge & experience, 3 things that will make them pass on by, they usually want weaker personality types, they know the odds they will get anything are small but it would take a lot of effort to find that out & they want easy ***, minimal effort but maximum gain so they will just move on

Edited January 18, 2023 by Deleted Member

[ey****]

I don't think scammers really read profiles
however, I do think they trade lists on people they've had some form of luck with.  "suckers lists" 

[Deleted Member]

25 minutes ago, eyemblacksheep said:

I don't think scammers really read profiles
however, I do think they trade lists on people they've had some form of luck with.  "suckers lists" 

There are sucker lists traded & those who just message accounts on mass on more organised level, but there are plenty of scammers who read profiles, often a more intelligent individual, just them no sharing or working with or for anyone, like we do for information about someone but they're looking for those profiles showing signs they can be manipulated for giving them some attention, those individual scammers could have multiple people going at a time, on several sites & when 1 dries up they find another. People can reveal a lot about themselves, especially if you know how to read between the lines of what they've put & they're looking for signs they have good income or wealth, what fantasies, kinks, needs & weaknesses they have, the things they can use to get that ***. 

Edited January 18, 2023 by Deleted Member

[ge****]

49 minutes ago, BrumDaddyDom said:

Your profile isn't really one a scammer or someone just wanting tributes would target, you show intelligence, knowledge & experience, 3 things that will make them pass on by, they usually want weaker personality types, they know the odds they will get anything are small but it would take a lot of effort to find that out & they want easy ***, minimal effort but maximum gain so they will just move on

Thank you that's kind but I'm not sure that's actually it the majority of the time - the more I've thought about it the more I suspect that it's not actually the scammers who make first contact in a lot of cases - they just set up a profile with pretty pictures and "come and get me" wording and leave the desperate to do the work for them - they don't even have to make an effort that way....is the perfect honeytrap

[Deleted Member]

14 hours ago, Uderiel said:

 Where is the art of earning a collar...

OP,  you made a good obversation. Alot of people think of it so casual. For me collaring is very special. I don't want any collars, or give it to anyone.

[ey****]

perhaps a spin-off, but, the kinda thing with a lot of the "I'll do anything" subs is that.... in most cases I don't think they intend to be timewasters, or hard work, or understand why people find them so frustrating

there is a little bit of a kinda, hoping that in seeming eager it'll increase their chances and also a bit where... they maybe haven't researched properly and find the idea they would be up for at least *trying* anything a good way to explore.

The problem is they really are like catnip to the scammers, ok, you'll do anything, you want to please, etc... pay me.  But even aside from any form of scammer, it's a very simple litmus test that actually you *say* you'll do anything but the absolute very first thing that is asked of you is a no.

That's a really poor start.

The other problem a little is a lot of people know they are labour intensive, because even if someone is up to potentially playing with them or chatting then "what do you want to do?", "anything!" has the kinda problems that the Dominant then has to coerce info out of them (i.e. "OK, but really what do you like the most? what do you really want to try?") while also pushing more work and responsibility onto the Dominant.

"Is he into this or just going through with it because it's what I thought he'd enjoy?" 

[Uderiel]

The art of earning a collar to me is proving subservience. From what I know in the community, a collar is much like a wedding ring. It is something earned not given. There are even different types of collars, from training collars, to day collars, to play collars, to ownership collars. The art of earning the collar comes from proving loyalty, intuition. Anticipation of commands and needs without words being said. Perhaps memorizing all the forms, of natu, etc. 

 

*** has been said to be intrinsically tied and I agree. Being In any relationship requires discussion and allocation of funds for shared mutual benefit, or desire. First date is sometimes a split bill, or either the Dominant or submissive pays. Its something to be discussed, and adjusted depending on the outcome. Gear and apparel is split, no one should be expected to cover all costs. Being asked to perform a simple task should be waiting until first meeting. I think chemistry is important, the physical interaction in person. First meeting should lay out expectations of both sides. Discussion of limits, things open to experiment with. It should be a build up. 

Demanding immediate obedience, or titles is a turn off only because I do not know you. A Dominant grooming a new submissive should work to earn trust and prove knowledgeable with application of toys, bindings, etc. A submissive should work to obey and learn the likes and dislikes, and be obedient as training progresses. Making their service unique. It's a give and take in the beginning which tests both D/s, both earning favor and trust in each other as they build up and learn each other. 

I have learned new things to watch out for. I have studied and learned what I can, and have no intentions of being a fake submissive or lacking in knowledge when I find a Dominant. I've only reached out to three people since coming here. But I fell for responding to a random spank a few times. I want to serve. To be of use, to learn from the Dominant who takes me well enough to anticipate their needs and earn a collar. I want to learn their specific likes and dislikes, clean or cooking, and learning forms of presentation and submission they like. It is not a fantasy or a dream. But a reality which many people can't accept. However I truly want to discover this and am not one of those who lack knowledge or willingness to work with someone who shows their abilities and capacity to lead. 

[Uderiel]

1 hour ago, kiseu said:

OP,  you made a good obversation. Alot of people think of it so casual. For me collaring is very special. I don't want any collars, or give it to anyone.

I apologize, I responded to your question in my last post on the forum, thinking this was already quoted. See above please. 

[Jimmmy]

Well I’ve been playing in this scene for over 30 years and I’ve seen a lot of changes. The modern “tolerant” society that we now live in, in the Western world, has cultivated and encouraged the growth of an entitled attitude amongst some. We are in a capitalist free market economy where just about anything can be monetised, and there will always be someone who will pay, if the price is set at the correct level. And it seems to work both ways: So, “If I pay you, I’m entitled to what I’ve paid for.”, and “If I give you what you want, I’m entitled to be paid.”

This works for transactions involving everyday goods and services, but is not necessarily a good starting place for anything involving personal commitments, especially if there’s emotional investment involved. For me, the most rewarding encounters and experiences have always involved some emotional investment. I don’t think the depth and intensity of that investment could be the same if in the back of my mind I’m thinking about the monetary cost of the experience. So I’ve never paid a “fee for services rendered” to anyone. But that doesn’t mean it hasn’t cost me financially.

Paying someone for a specific experience, or to deliver a particular scenario, is sometimes the only potentially guaranteed way to live out a long-held fantasy, and this sometimes is an appropriate and legitimate course to take. Think of it as one of the aforementioned “services”. But the original post was about D/s relationships. This implies a more long term relationship than a one-off encounter. There will be some that would be happy to keep paying for someone to deliver realisation of their fantasies on an ongoing basis, much as someone would keep paying for a regular massage or yoga session, but the dynamic of such encounters is obviously going to be considerably different to that experienced by both parties to a mutually beneficial, willing and freely-given exchange that is without financial implication or cost for either side, other than costs of equipment, for example.

I have had a regular play partner, with whom I have enjoyed an emotionally invested D/s relationship for some time now. This is a mutually beneficial relationship that involves no financial transaction either way. We play together because we both enjoy it. It’s fun! But I have spent considerable monies on kit and equipment for our mutual enjoyment. My play partner has spent considerable monies on hosting me, feeding me, and other expenses. I spend *** on fuel when I visit and when we go out places in my car, and they incur costs if they pay for a meal, for example. But because none of this is in a “findom” dynamic, it doesn’t impact upon the emotional connection we have. The monetary costs are simply part of the accepted expenses of our meetings.

I have never been approached for *** by a would-be playmate. I evidently don’t attract such people. But I have been asked to lend a playmate ***. And I have done. And it was paid back. That sort of transaction has no implications on the emotional investment side of a relationship. Regular payments made under a findom situation could potentially have huge implications.

I consider that this site and others like it used to be primarily places to find other like minded folk and potentially meet up with playmates, after having gotten to know them. Now it seems that notwithstanding that there are some really genuine, decent kinksters and some jolly nice folk on here, there are also a growing number of those with definite malintent, seeking out some unsuspecting or naïve *** person to defraud or scam. It’s such a shame.

To generalise and say that the scene has “faded” and that there is a lot of activity “but without the actual sex”, is probably not far off the mark. I’ve witnessed that in the last few years. I think that the pandemic worsened the situation.

You have to be pretty persistent to find good playmates. And as has been said by many before, simply having a profile on here and waiting for someone to find you, isn’t going to be very productive. It takes time, effort and commitment to meet up with suitable playmates. You have to message people, be active on the site and eventually people build trust in you. Slagging off people because they won’t meet you won’t get you anywhere either. And some of the misogynist comments I’ve read on here are pretty vile. Do the peddlers of this crap expect it to get them laid? Idiots!

Although I’ve met up with playmates on this site with whom I’ve had great fun, I’d consider that I’ve put in a disproportionate amount of time and effort for the reward of playing, compared to the very little effort I’ve had to invest to quickly meet up with playmates on other “hookup” sites. My current long term playmate was met on such a hookup site. This site is definitely for those who want to chew the fat and discuss stuff, sometimes at a cerebral level, rather than jump straight in with a stranger for a meet, I think. And that’s fine, but I think it also means that it’s a place where scammers can lurk for a long time, getting to know people that may be somewhat ***, before making their move. You tend to get fuckwits and idiots on hookup sites, but they’re easy to spot and they soon clear off. Scammers on this site can be very clever. They’re in no rush. And they’ll often be tricky to spot.

It’s a difficult one. You want to meet like minded people, but you don’t want to be scammed. You want to have fun, but you don’t want to wait for two years! You want to get to know a bit about potential playmates but you have a full time job and can’t spend eight hours a day on here! Tricky, isn’t it?

The majority of people on here are here for the same thing, one way or another: we all want to feel the joy of being needed and appreciated by another human being, and to experience the pleasure of making someone else happy. So be yourself. Don’t put on an act. We all see right through so many attitudinal “damaged” people on here who try to be “The Big I Am”. It’s not attractive. Don’t try to be someone you’re not. It really doesn’t work. And spread your net wide, using other sites and apps also. But keep your wits about you. This way, with some effort, you’ll find a playmate that’s suitable for you, who isn’t a scammer, ghoster, fuckwit, toxic twink or duplicitous twat. Good luck!

[Ro****]

I agree with this and it’s so unfortunate , so many people making a mockery of this lifestyle. Making it solely about sex or not understanding what it means to be part of this lifestyle at all. As someone who is a true submissive, who is so passionate about this lifestyle and all the things it has to offer I find it so frustrating sometimes when I see idiots in the lobby , I’ve came to know not to bother and focus myself where possible on people who actually know what it means to be within this lifestyle. Having a community can be great. So the few that are on the same page , I appreciate them! We’re rare breeds now haha! But I suppose that’s also the beauty of it when you find someone like minded as you! I’m proud of every single person in this lifestyle who isn’t afraid to show exactly who they are. So many lack of understanding or pure ignorance about the mindset of different things.

[Deleted Member]

1 hour ago, Rorykitten said:

I agree with this and it’s so unfortunate , so many people making a mockery of this lifestyle. Making it solely about sex or not understanding what it means to be part of this lifestyle at all. As someone who is a true submissive, who is so passionate about this lifestyle and all the things it has to offer I find it so frustrating sometimes when I see idiots in the lobby , I’ve came to know not to bother and focus myself where possible on people who actually know what it means to be within this lifestyle. Having a community can be great. So the few that are on the same page , I appreciate them! We’re rare breeds now haha! But I suppose that’s also the beauty of it when you find someone like minded as you! I’m proud of every single person in this lifestyle who isn’t afraid to show exactly who they are. So many lack of understanding or pure ignorance about the mindset of different things.

From one submissive to another well said, Truly submissive Personality’s are being bred out by the dog eat dog materialistic *** led world especially the way submissive people are treated by abusive false dominants want to be paid tributes before even meeting to se if there is a connection between each other yes and he kink world is expensive and the support and cost should be shared but only when in some sort of D/S relationship, personal items, gifts both ways to show appreciation, playroom furniture to expand the ability to push the submissiveness limits are all things that should be shared in the special unique relationship