The "Importance" of Consent Models in Kink.

[CopperKnob]

SSC
PRICK
RACK

The recipe for informed consent in kink might be the above but even if you put all those letters in a mixing bowl and stirred till blended i don't believe that you would necessarily get enough consent for a truly ethical scene.
Every word in those acronyms is utterly useless without some further thought and consideration.
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These are my thoughts as a discussion post.
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SSC
"Safe” could mean a spanking with a feather, or it could mean breath play with a BOC cannister next to you. “Sane” could mean a bit of rope play, or it could mean doing anything that requires a defibrillator on the bedside table.
Who decides what is safe or sane? It's far too subjective for me.
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RACK
Among those of us who are lazy, all RACK means is, “I’m gonna use this thing on you, and I know that that’s risky”
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Risk awareness may well lead to informed consent, but is it enough?
I'm aware that guns in the wrong hands are deadly, yet death by vehicle is far more prolific. Guess which I spend more time near.
RACK needs a little more. Awareness is useless unless you’re doing everything possible to mitigate that risk. Where's the responsibility in RACK to mitigate the risk/s? Are we using RACK for no other reason than to excuse ourselves of our ethical duties?
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Aware of and Mitigating the Risk of Kink - AoaMtRoK?
Risk Aware and Accountable Towards Risk Creating Consensual Kink - RAaATRCCK?

Quite the tongue twisters.
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PRICK
Contains the words “personal responsibility” which basically means if things go wrong it’s your own ***y fault and no one elses.

By the same token, PRICK is not a 'gotcha' to use after your inexperience/recklessness hurts your bottom/sub...
"I’m PRICK, dahling. You should have been more careful about playing with someone who hangs bottoms from the neck”
PRICK doesn’t mean it's okay to use your beginner skills to *** out your girlfriend without a safe signal.
PRICK doesn’t mean performing brain surgery without anaesethic, then telling the patient they should have been more responsible about choosing a neurosurgeon.
PRICK doesn’t mean “I'm PRICK, so I don’t give a 🦆 and besides, you knew I was a 🍆.” even if it does rhyme.

There are two or more players in a kink scene. PRICK requires the personal responsibility of all parties, not just those who aren't you. Consent models shouldn't be used to escape our ethical duties.
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Whatever the model of consent being used all can be ineffectual if in the wrong hands. In the eyes of the law, consent is not black or white, but (all you lifestylers grab your pearls now for some serious clutching) various shades of grey. Probably more than 50.
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The above acronyms are nothing more than guidance/theories. They're as much use as a chocolate teapot.
They're only useful if we interpret the answers intelligently, but they're still subjective. Anyone can justify anything with four letters and nefarious intentions, so if you’re considering a new partner, look deeper at SSC, RACK, PRICK, or whatever model you or they are using. It"s not enough to know what the letters stand for. Don't ask them if they're aware of or following them. Ask them what those letters mean to them. Do they see any flaws in any of the models? Do you? Their answer/s may just show enough red flags to keep you safe because, without a true understanding or application, we're on a sticky wicket with regards to informed consent.

[El****]

Nice job.
I'm guided by the CCCC framework. COMMUNICATION, CONSENT, CARE, CAUTION.

[TheBookCollector]

I apporach informed consent by asking if my partner knows what X is, and the dangers that go with it.

Eg Rope suspension, if my partners new to rope bondage i have her read up on the subject including what can go wrong with various online guides and then go through things like identifying nerve damage, ***flow restrictions, how she has to communicate.

[Cu****]

Perhaps “anyone who can justify anything with four letters” with wicked or criminal intentions”, shouldn’t be here in the first place. Such acts of deception will land them in serious bother with the Crown Prosecution Service, who are catching up on “grey” areas of behaviour. In a very recent report of a survey amongst 3000, 18-24 year olds , that CPS carried out, their lead prosecutor for *** and serious sexual offences in England & Wales, Siobhan Blake, told a UK national radio broadcaster that the “harmful assumption" that consent can be given in advance is now "playing out in the digital world".

Ms Blake told the broadcaster, "The law of consent is clear - someone has to have the freedom and capacity to consent at that particular moment in time. It's not possible for another individual to simply assume consent based on previous conversations or behaviours.

"We have to be clear that consent is about consent in the moment." Two thirds of those surveyed BELIEVED that you can’t withdraw consent IN PERSON, after agreeing to have sex in an online conversation. I’m not sure if the news this week about longer prison sentences for men who used a “rough sex” defence after killing someone, is a further awakening of the CPS getting tougher.

[CopperKnob]

  2 hours ago, CumbriaLeather said:

Perhaps “anyone who can justify anything with four letters” with wicked or criminal intentions”, shouldn’t be here in the first place. Such acts of deception will land them in serious bother with the Crown Prosecution Service, who are catching up on “grey” areas of behaviour. In a very recent report of a survey amongst 3000, 18-24 year olds , that CPS carried out, their lead prosecutor for *** and serious sexual offences in England & Wales, Siobhan Blake, told a UK national radio broadcaster that the “harmful assumption" that consent can be given in advance is now "playing out in the digital world".

Ms Blake told the broadcaster, "The law of consent is clear - someone has to have the freedom and capacity to consent at that particular moment in time. It's not possible for another individual to simply assume consent based on previous conversations or behaviours.

"We have to be clear that consent is about consent in the moment." Two thirds of those surveyed BELIEVED that you can’t withdraw consent IN PERSON, after agreeing to have sex in an online conversation. I’m not sure if the news this week about longer prison sentences for men who used a “rough sex” defence after killing someone, is a further awakening of the CPS getting tougher.

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The CPS may be getting tougher, but the MoJ aren't. They've a new policy re early releases which only weeks in has created all sorts of issues (surprise).
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My other thought is this, we need Police on board, without them CPS aren't able to authorise charges and we all know the issues around a) reporting but also b) the Polices attitude towards reports of SA
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Until the Police/CPS/Courts are clear on consent (and I don't believe that they are having observed it first hand) we have very little hope.

[CopperKnob]

  5 hours ago, ElDracu said:

Nice job.
I'm guided by the CCCC framework. COMMUNICATION, CONSENT, CARE, CAUTION.

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I don't know that I've come across this one. Even still though, it needs consideration as to what it actually means in reality. Words that rhyme or alliteration just doesn't cut it

[El****]

I could have a conversation spanning weeks around these 4 words.
For me, it makes the most sense.

 

[El****]

Or just Google CCCC BDSM

[CopperKnob]

  13 minutes ago, ElDracu said:

Or just Google CCCC BDSM

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I think when CL is citing CPS research indicating a significant amount of young adults failed to understand consent and when it was a Police Officer who suggested to me that consent is not black and white, then this is another model that falls down.
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My point was that all of these models are useful, I'm not disregarding them at all, but we have to look behind the words understand what they actually mean so that we can act upon them.
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I've been in a situation where I was talking rope with someone, their safety measure meant having shears nearby.
In comparison, mine was the type of tie, where the tie was on my body, my dodgy knee and rib, location (where this was happening), and many more thoughts. The other individual told me they followed SSC, and yet none of this was discussed, nor was it followed up when I raised it. Their understanding and application of a well known/discussed consent model was lacking.

[El****]

BDSM IS "continuous learning".
I strongly support educational initiatives. However, I believe the audience must be considered because the ones, especially wannabe Dom's, who are responsible for everyone's safety, already have unlimited information readily accessible and the ones who are in a *** position, like newcomers, must be the target of education.
Assertive communication assessments, consent risk profile, vetting processes, identifying narcissists, asking key questions, etc. The submissive needs to learn how to stay away from danger and where to put her/his trust.

[po****]

ElDracu I agree that new folks are the ones who need to be the most educated. (and a good section of it should also be about putting away various misconceptions on the stereotypes of kink and another chuck about how having a big ego will get you hurt (it isnt being tough to not say yellow or red). But there are new unexperienced wannabe Doms all the time and they are still in control of a lot of the safety and have the ability to make a hostile environment for a sub trying to advocate for themself. so both doms and subs should be educated, and i agree the target should be people new to kink or kink with another person

[El****]

  19 minutes ago, CopperKnob said:

I think when CL is citing CPS research indicating a significant amount of young adults failed to understand consent and when it was a Police Officer who suggested to me that consent is not black and white, then this is another model that falls down.
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My point was that all of these models are useful, I'm not disregarding them at all, but we have to look behind the words understand what they actually mean so that we can act upon them.
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I've been in a situation where I was talking rope with someone, their safety measure meant having shears nearby.
In comparison, mine was the type of tie, where the tie was on my body, my dodgy knee and rib, location (where this was happening), and many more thoughts. The other individual told me they followed SSC, and yet none of this was discussed, nor was it followed up when I raised it. Their understanding and application of a well known/discussed consent model was lacking.

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Consent: surface, scene and the most crucial, "deep consent". How do you deal with a masochistic sub while in subspace and provoking you beyond her limits?

[El****]

It's a lot of conversation, not possible in this space.

[CopperKnob]

  20 minutes ago, ElDracu said:

BDSM IS "continuous learning".
I strongly support educational initiatives. However, I believe the audience must be considered because the ones, especially wannabe Dom's, who are responsible for everyone's safety, already have unlimited information readily accessible and the ones who are in a *** position, like newcomers, must be the target of education.
Assertive communication assessments, consent risk profile, vetting processes, identifying narcissists, asking key questions, etc. The submissive needs to learn how to stay away from danger and where to put her/his trust.

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I agree. It is continuous education like everything in life.
I disagree that the D's are responsible for everyone's safety. It's a shared venture. By saying that it falls solely on the D's shoulders suggests that the s is a passive participant.
The s also has accountability, as indicated above. It's much more than staying away from danger and learning who/when to trust.
I also don't know that all D's have unlimited access to information. Again, that comes down to their own accountability to seek it out, take it on board, self reflect, and put their learning in action.

[TheBookCollector]

  5 minutes ago, ElDracu said:

Consent: surface, scene and the most crucial, "deep consent". How do you deal with a masochistic sub while in subspace and provoking you beyond her limits?

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As the dom/top youre the one supposed to be in control so you make decision to cease. If you are incapable of controlling yourself rising to provocation when you know that its beyond negotiated pre-agreed consent are you really fit to be in the lifestyle?

[CopperKnob]

  16 minutes ago, poisonscales said:

ElDracu I agree that new folks are the ones who need to be the most educated. (and a good section of it should also be about putting away various misconceptions on the stereotypes of kink and another chuck about how having a big ego will get you hurt (it isnt being tough to not say yellow or red). But there are new unexperienced wannabe Doms all the time and they are still in control of a lot of the safety and have the ability to make a hostile environment for a sub trying to advocate for themself. so both doms and subs should be educated, and i agree the target should be people new to kink or kink with another person

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Very much so. And, the damn stereotypes of D/s have a lot to answer for. Sometimes, I feel that stypes feel the need to go along with something or not advocate for themselves because of the 'idea' of what being a submissive is.
Actually, new idea for a thread 👍

[CopperKnob]

  7 minutes ago, ElDracu said:

It's a lot of conversation, not possible in this space.

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Agreed, but I think it's a conversation that needs to take place in this arena. People new to BDSM will often dip their toe in the water in an online space rather than the real world.
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Plus it makes a change to the typical posts we see on rotation.

[El****]

You are very correct, sir. Maybe I need to look at my attitude and try to contribute outside my circle of influence.

[El****]

Apologies and correction, I meant "Miss".